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> Let's talk about "Retard" and "Shucking and Jiving&, Anti-Social Social Media Mavens?
nighttimer
post Oct 25 2012, 01:02 PM
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Because to them attention is like air, two of the Right's leading pin-ups, Ann Coulter and Sarah Palin shared their political insights with the rest of America this week.

After the third and final debate between President Obama and former Governor Mitt Romney, Coulter tweeted, I highly approve of Romney's decision to be kind and gentle to the retard.

Coulter has been condemned as being thoughtless and heartless by families with special needs children. Naturally, she has thus far refused to apologize.

As if someone like Coulter who craves attention like a crack whore craves her next hit could possibly be shamed or embarrassed by her brain-dead remarks.

Not to be outdone, Sarah Palin, the resident Fox News commentator whose political expertise hinges on losing a presidential race and quitting her job governor of Alaska, popped off about the current event that has conservatives in a mouth-foaming frenzy, the attacks on the American embassy in Benghazi and what and when the Obama Administration knew about it being a terrorist attack.

Palin wrote on her Facebook page, "Why the lies? Why the cover up? Why the dissembling about the cause of the murder of our ambassador on the anniversary of the worst terrorist attacks on American soil? We deserve answers to this. President Obama's shuck and jive shtick with these Benghazi lies must end."

I don't buy for one second that even the spectacularly stupid Sarah Palin is unaware of the racial connotations of a phrase like "shuck and jive." She knows exactly what it means and that is why she said it.

The Urban Dictionary defines the term as: To "shuck and jive" originally referred to the intentionally misleading words and actions that African-Americans would employ in order to deceive racist Euro-Americans in power, both during the period of slavery and afterwards. The expression was documented as being in wide usage in the 1920s, but may have originated much earlier.

"Shucking and jiving" was a tactic of both survival and resistance. A slave, for instance, could say eagerly, "Oh, yes, Master," and have no real intention to obey. Or an African-American man could pretend to be working hard at a task he was ordered to do, but might put up this pretense only when under observation. Both would be instances of "doin' the old shuck 'n jive."

It has been adopted into non-Afroamerican speech, with a reference to behavior adopted in order to avoid criticism.


Nothing like a tasty little bit of race bait just before the election. rolleyes.gif

The questions for debate:

1. Should Ann Coulter apologize for anyone offended by her description of Obama as a "retard?"

2. Is Sarah Palin race-baiting by describing the president's responses to the Benghazi incident as a"shuck and jive schtick?"

3. Is describing someone as a "retard" or "shucking and jiving" offensive or fair criticism?

4. As neither Coulter or Palin hold any office or wield any influence are they relevant to this election?
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AuthorMusician
post Oct 27 2012, 12:41 PM
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QUOTE(Bikerdad @ Oct 26 2012, 05:19 PM) *
QUOTE(Amlord @ Oct 26 2012, 01:45 PM) *
Perhaps she isn't offended by it? "Retard" is a pretty common school yard insult these days.
"These days"?!? It's been a common schoolyard insult for generations.


Not so. In my schoolyard, it was nimrod. We were too young to get the Biblical and historical connections. Now I know that the great hunter and leader went and built the Tower of Babel, which didn't work out so well. Therefore, being a nimrod is being really stupid with a good load of arrogance.

However, remember Palin jumping all over Letterman? Yep, she practices highly selective outrage, but hey, it seems par for the course in Republican thinking these days.

I also would pay good money to see a Coulter-Palin smack-down. In this corner, weighing in at 75 pounds, the reigning lightweight champion, Cranky Coulter! Her challenger, weighing in at 105 pounds (by her scale), Provoked Palin! All right, no hitting below the belt, no hair pulling, no scratching, and may the best bitch win! (Channeling Jersey Housewives here via The Neighbors.)
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nighttimer
post Oct 27 2012, 02:14 PM
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QUOTE(Amlord @ Oct 26 2012, 03:45 PM) *
QUOTE(nighttimer @ Oct 25 2012, 11:12 PM) *
So if Coulter and Palin decide to simply cut to the chase and call Obama a "nigger" that wouldn't be offensive to you. Just politics. Got it.


That word is so passe. I also heard it ten times in the last week come out of my son's IPod by black musicians. The "N word" simply doesn't carry the same meaning as it did when you and I grew up.


Really? Why don't you try testing that theory? Walk up to the first Black person you see, regardless of age and say, "Hello, nigger," or "Hey nigger, you got the time?" Next time you're at work, go talk to your bestest Black buddy, put an arm around his or her shoulder and say with a smile, "You're not one of those overly sensitive niggers who get offended by being called a nigger, are you?"

If you don't get cussed out or knocked out, maybe your preposterous assertion will be proven to be true. What I'm certain of is while ignorant rappers who use "nigga," a bastardization of the slur, to entertain shallow White kids who think they're getting a musical tour of life in the 'hood, and Samuel L. Jackson and Chris Rock can make money off of saying, "nigger", it remains a pejorative and an insult to the majority of 36 million African-Americans.

"Nigger" does carry the same meaning as it did when I grew up. It's not a funny word or a term of endearment and it certainly isn't a compliment. (Usain Bolt is one fast nigger. Halle Berry sure is pretty for a nigger. Barack Obama is one smart nigger. )

I have no idea what meaning it had to you growing up. But if you think it's okay to say "nigger" because some rapper hustling White kids for money says so, you really haven't grown up at all.

But go ahead, Amlord. Explain to your boss and the Human Relations department when you called a Black employer a "nigger" it was okay because Black rappers use that word all the time and you kept count of how many times you heard them say it while your son was listening to them last week.

I doubt a Nikki Minaj defense will work in the face of an EEOC complaint, but if you believe it will, give it a shot.

QUOTE(Amlord)
QUOTE(nighttimer @ Oct 25 2012, 11:12 PM) *
Growing a thicker skin is not a defense against incivility, ignorance and race-based hatred as exemplified by two of the Right wing's favorite centerfolds. If calling someone a "retard" isn't offensive, are we now free on ad.gif to dismiss any debate we disagree with as "retarded" and the debater as a "retard?"


Growing a thicker skin is the ONLY defense. Should I be insulted by what you think my opinions are? Should I be insulted if someone thinks I'm dumb, or a racist, or hate women or want poor people to starve? No, because they aren't true and I know it. My thick skin protects me from being offended by your opinion of me.


Wrong. Growing a thicker skin is NOT the only defense. The opinions of people I don't know mean nothing to me, but that doesn't mean I have to suffer in silence their dumb, racist, misogynistic or selfish opinions. It doesn't mean you're not dumb, racist, misogynistic or selfish because you say you're not. Your thick skin may only be shutting out the truth of how you really are to others from sinking in to your thicker skull.

To say if you're on the receiving end of a racist insult, it's your fault for taking offense and that's absurd. The person who makes the nasty crack is the one responsible for any nastiness that ensues.

Palin and Coulter can't slither off the hook for their offensive remarks when others take offense.

QUOTE(Amlord)
Coulter does what she does. She throws out bombs to get a reaction. As Pavlov predicted, here you are reacting.


The Pavlovian reaction here is your slobbering defense of Coulter and Palin. At the sound of the bell, you begin to drool this utter idiocy that "nigger" no longer means anything.

QUOTE(Amlord)
Newsflash: Everyone in the country knows that Barack Obama is half-black. If that affects their vote, then it has already affected their vote. Palin's use of a fairly obscure (but not unknown) term to describe the administration's treatment of Benghazi is not a racial epithet, even if you and Rachel Maddow and other MSNBC types are offended, unless she intended it as a racial epithet.


Here's another newsflash for you: White people in America? Still racist.
QUOTE
WASHINGTON (AP) Racial attitudes have not improved in the four years since the United States elected its first black president, an Associated Press poll finds, as a slight majority of Americans now express prejudice toward blacks whether they recognize those feelings or not.

Those views could cost President Barack Obama votes as he tries for re-election, the survey found, though the effects are mitigated by some Americans' more favorable views of blacks.

Racial prejudice has increased slightly since 2008 whether those feelings were measured using questions that explicitly asked respondents about racist attitudes, or through an experimental test that measured implicit views toward race without asking questions about that topic directly.

In all, 51 percent of Americans now express explicit anti-black attitudes, compared with 48 percent in a similar 2008 survey. When measured by an implicit racial attitudes test, the number of Americans with anti-black sentiments jumped to 56 percent, up from 49 percent during the last presidential election. In both tests, the share of Americans expressing pro-black attitudes fell.

"As much as we'd hope the impact of race would decline over time ... it appears the impact of anti-black sentiment on voting is about the same as it was four years ago," said Jon Krosnick, a Stanford University professor who worked with AP to develop the survey
.


"Shuck and jive" is obscure? Based upon what? You know what it means. I know what it means. Sarah Palin definitely knows what it means. Is there no limit to how far you will go as a Palin apologist. Perhaps you, Sean Hannity and the other Fox News crew want everybody to agree with you that Palin is so stupid she doesn't know what the words she uses means, but just because you're drinking the Kool-Aid doesn't mean I'm thirsty.

QUOTE(Amlord)
Words that used to be inflammatory have entered into the vernacular. They don't mean the same thing with the same context as before. Which is why we can say bitch and crap and various other things on TV now.


Nobody here is on TV and if you don't think "bitch" means the same thing anymore, try calling a female employee a bitch and see how that works out for you.

QUOTE(Amlord)
QUOTE(BoF @ Oct 26 2012, 02:16 PM) *
Here's what surprises me. Sarah Palin has a Down's Syndrome child. Yet she has not criticizes Coulter's use of the word "retard." I would suggest that Palin has a severe case of "same team" syndrome.

Perhaps she isn't offended by it? "Retard" is a pretty common school yard insult these days.


Palin was offended plenty two years ago. What's changed now besides Coulter is a conservative and Rahm Emanuel is not?

And does anyone here still play on schoolyards? No? Then we can make the wild assumption we're all ADULTS here and what flies on a schoolyard doesn't fly in the world of grown-ups.

On this board you can't call a Black debater a nigger or say they are "shucking and jiving." You can't call a female debater a bitch. You can't call another debater a retard. You're a Moderator, Amlord so correct me if I'm wrong about any of that.

And you can't do it it in the world of grown-ups without being called on it and suffering the consequences. For supporters of Coulter and Palin, it's a reason to blow it off as no big deal. For everyone else it confirms how detestable these two classless women are.

Notice I did not call Coulter and Palin "bitches." According to you, I could have and it would be all good. dry.gif
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