Full Version: What the heck is up with Kansas?
Kansas, the state that gave us intelligent design instead of science, is at it again:
Zach was suspended for 1 ½ days for uttering those two words. There was nothing about what happened to the other kid (after all, he spoke twice as many Spanish words!), and whether he was Caucasian or Hispanic. Regardless, I find the action of the teacher and principal outrageous. It’s not as if Zach was refusing to speak English in class, or demanding that he be taught in Spanish. Is Kansas becoming the (pre-civil rights) Mississippi of 2005? Zach’s father is a US citizen and also speaks fluent English, and yet, he too experiences the ignorance of some of his neighbors:
In my opinion, if Zach wanted to speak in Urdu outside the classroom, it’s his business and no one else’s. Maybe those Kansas hayseeds are just jealous because the can only speak one language?
Should speaking Spanish in the hallways of school justify suspension?
Is Mr. Rubio justified in suing the school district for violation of his son’s civil rights?
Should any disciplinary action be taken against the teacher who reported the incident, and the principal who imposed the suspension? What action would be appropriate?
QUOTE
Most of the time, 16-year-old Zach Rubio converses in clear, unaccented American teen-speak, a form of English in which the three most common words are "like," "whatever" and "totally." But Zach is also fluent in his dad's native language, Spanish -- and that's what got him suspended from school.
"It was, like, totally not in the classroom," the high school junior said, recalling the infraction. "We were in the, like, hall or whatever, on restroom break. This kid I know, he's like, 'Me prestas un dolar?' ['Will you lend me a dollar?'] Well, he asked in Spanish; it just seemed natural to answer that way. So I'm like, 'No problema.' " MSNBC
"It was, like, totally not in the classroom," the high school junior said, recalling the infraction. "We were in the, like, hall or whatever, on restroom break. This kid I know, he's like, 'Me prestas un dolar?' ['Will you lend me a dollar?'] Well, he asked in Spanish; it just seemed natural to answer that way. So I'm like, 'No problema.' " MSNBC
Zach was suspended for 1 ½ days for uttering those two words. There was nothing about what happened to the other kid (after all, he spoke twice as many Spanish words!), and whether he was Caucasian or Hispanic. Regardless, I find the action of the teacher and principal outrageous. It’s not as if Zach was refusing to speak English in class, or demanding that he be taught in Spanish. Is Kansas becoming the (pre-civil rights) Mississippi of 2005? Zach’s father is a US citizen and also speaks fluent English, and yet, he too experiences the ignorance of some of his neighbors:
QUOTE
"But sometimes, when they hear my accent, I get this, sort of, 'Why don't you go back home?' "
<snip>
"A fully bilingual young man like Zach Rubio should be considered an asset to the community," said Janet Murguia, national president of La Raza. (ibid.)
<snip>
"A fully bilingual young man like Zach Rubio should be considered an asset to the community," said Janet Murguia, national president of La Raza. (ibid.)
In my opinion, if Zach wanted to speak in Urdu outside the classroom, it’s his business and no one else’s. Maybe those Kansas hayseeds are just jealous because the can only speak one language?
Should speaking Spanish in the hallways of school justify suspension?
Is Mr. Rubio justified in suing the school district for violation of his son’s civil rights?
Should any disciplinary action be taken against the teacher who reported the incident, and the principal who imposed the suspension? What action would be appropriate?
QUOTE(DaffyGrl @ Dec 9 2005, 04:39 PM)
Should speaking Spanish in the hallways of school justify suspension?
Is Mr. Rubio justified in suing the school district for violation of his son’s civil rights?
Should any disciplinary action be taken against the teacher who reported the incident, and the principal who imposed the suspension? What action would be appropriate?
Is Mr. Rubio justified in suing the school district for violation of his son’s civil rights?
Should any disciplinary action be taken against the teacher who reported the incident, and the principal who imposed the suspension? What action would be appropriate?
I don't believe that speaking in another language in the halls of the school should warrant anything but a pat on the back. Here in Texas, we seek out bilingual employees on a regular basis and often pay a premium for such services.
Mr. Rubio should sue, but not for financial gain. I believe that the school shouldn't discourage such conduct, unless in a harmful or criminal manner. However, if Mr. Rubio wins financial compensation it will hurt everyone in the school district as opposed to those truly responsible.
The teacher/principle should reassess the rules and their standings on such disciplinary action. The fact that Kansas is less of a bilingual society negates the fact that speaking multiple languages does not detract from the learning environment. In Texas, we have programs that cater specifically to students whom have english as a second language, and many of these students revel in the idea that America took them in and made them "their own"...
Should speaking Spanish in the hallways of school justify suspension?
Of course not! As long as the kid is not making threats or interrupting class, he's protected by the first amendment.
Is Mr. Rubio justified in suing the school district for violation of his son’s civil rights?
As long as he's not seeking a million dollars or anything outrageous. Mr. Rubio should sue to get the suspension erased from his kid's record and sue to get a public apology.
Should any disciplinary action be taken against the teacher who reported the incident, and the principal who imposed the suspension? What action would be appropriate?
The teacher and the Principal should issue a public apology for their action.
Of course not! As long as the kid is not making threats or interrupting class, he's protected by the first amendment.
Is Mr. Rubio justified in suing the school district for violation of his son’s civil rights?
As long as he's not seeking a million dollars or anything outrageous. Mr. Rubio should sue to get the suspension erased from his kid's record and sue to get a public apology.
Should any disciplinary action be taken against the teacher who reported the incident, and the principal who imposed the suspension? What action would be appropriate?
The teacher and the Principal should issue a public apology for their action.
Should speaking Spanish in the hallways of school justify suspension?
Is Mr. Rubio justified in suing the school district for violation of his son’s civil rights?
Should any disciplinary action be taken against the teacher who reported the incident, and the principal who imposed the suspension? What action would be appropriate?
[/quote]
Unusually I find myself in full agreement with aevans176 on this one.
This suspension is grossly inappropriate - this kid should be held up as a role model not vilified (as well being biluingual, he's generous with his cash!).
Mr Rubio is entirely justified in suing, though I too would rather see his (anticipated) victory rewarded with the punichment of the wrong-headed school authorities rather than monetary compensation.
I'd like to see the teacher and headteacher responsible for this antithesis of the correct action punished in some kind of circular way. Perhaps they could be forcibly banished to a non-Anglophone country for a few years?
Is Mr. Rubio justified in suing the school district for violation of his son’s civil rights?
Should any disciplinary action be taken against the teacher who reported the incident, and the principal who imposed the suspension? What action would be appropriate?
[/quote]
Unusually I find myself in full agreement with aevans176 on this one.
This suspension is grossly inappropriate - this kid should be held up as a role model not vilified (as well being biluingual, he's generous with his cash!).
Mr Rubio is entirely justified in suing, though I too would rather see his (anticipated) victory rewarded with the punichment of the wrong-headed school authorities rather than monetary compensation.
I'd like to see the teacher and headteacher responsible for this antithesis of the correct action punished in some kind of circular way. Perhaps they could be forcibly banished to a non-Anglophone country for a few years?
I will postpone judgement until I hear both sides of this case. Right now, the principal cannot reveal any of the details of the case, so we are left with an entirely one-sided perspective...which is never accurate.
Here's a thought. Don't you think it's a little strange that the boy he was speaking with did not apparently receive any disciplinary measures, even though he was speaking Spanish? There is likely a history of disciplinary problems that are directly related to Zach and his spanish, which led to a no-tolerance policy specifically for him.
I once put a child on detention for sneezing. From one a one-sided perspective, that sounds ridiculous. That child, however, had a history of severe disciplinary problems in my class. The "sneeze" was during a test, in an effort to disrupt the room and it wasn't a real sneeze....it was a loud "AH! AH! AH! AH! AH! AH!!!!!!AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH CHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!"
My last school had a no-tolerance policy for guns. If a person drew a gun on paper, or made a flat pretend one out of paper to play cops and robbers with at recess, they would receive suspension. One boy brought a bullet shell to school which his grandfather gave him to show to his friends (the casing only, which has much less lethal potential than a spoon), and was suspended for an entire week. He was almost kicked out of school permanently. That was a little ridiculous, but people had been shot at that school...in fact one of my team teachers was greeted at the door of her classroom with a gun to the face by a mad parent. There is usually much, much more to a story like this than the one side you are hearing.
Here's a thought. Don't you think it's a little strange that the boy he was speaking with did not apparently receive any disciplinary measures, even though he was speaking Spanish? There is likely a history of disciplinary problems that are directly related to Zach and his spanish, which led to a no-tolerance policy specifically for him.
I once put a child on detention for sneezing. From one a one-sided perspective, that sounds ridiculous. That child, however, had a history of severe disciplinary problems in my class. The "sneeze" was during a test, in an effort to disrupt the room and it wasn't a real sneeze....it was a loud "AH! AH! AH! AH! AH! AH!!!!!!AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH CHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!"
My last school had a no-tolerance policy for guns. If a person drew a gun on paper, or made a flat pretend one out of paper to play cops and robbers with at recess, they would receive suspension. One boy brought a bullet shell to school which his grandfather gave him to show to his friends (the casing only, which has much less lethal potential than a spoon), and was suspended for an entire week. He was almost kicked out of school permanently. That was a little ridiculous, but people had been shot at that school...in fact one of my team teachers was greeted at the door of her classroom with a gun to the face by a mad parent. There is usually much, much more to a story like this than the one side you are hearing.
QUOTE(Mrs. Pigpen @ Dec 10 2005, 05:05 PM)
I will postpone judgement until I hear both sides of this case. Right now, the principal cannot reveal any of the details of the case, so we are left with an entirely one-sided perspective...which is never accurate.
Here's a thought. Don't you think it's a little strange that the boy he was speaking with did not apparently receive any disciplinary measures, even though he was speaking Spanish? There is likely a history of disciplinary problems that are directly related to Zach and his spanish, which led to a no-tolerance policy specifically for him.
There is usually much, much more to a story like this than the one side you are hearing.
Here's a thought. Don't you think it's a little strange that the boy he was speaking with did not apparently receive any disciplinary measures, even though he was speaking Spanish? There is likely a history of disciplinary problems that are directly related to Zach and his spanish, which led to a no-tolerance policy specifically for him.
There is usually much, much more to a story like this than the one side you are hearing.
Miss Pigpen I agree with your reserved attitude towards this issue. On first sight the punishment seems completely out of context (suspention for speaking Spanish in a hall
), but unless we know more about Zach, the teacher that reported him to the head teacher etc, etc, we cannot form a decent opinion on this case. It seems absurd, but who knows what's the complete story behind this newsfact.
QUOTE
A teacher who overheard the two boys sent Zach to the office, where Principal Jennifer Watts ordered him to call his father and leave the school.
Watts, whom students describe as a disciplinarian, said she can't discuss the case. But in a written "discipline referral" explaining her decision to suspend Zach for 1 1/2 days, she noted: This is not the first time we have [asked] Zach and others to not speak Spanish at school.
Watts, whom students describe as a disciplinarian, said she can't discuss the case. But in a written "discipline referral" explaining her decision to suspend Zach for 1 1/2 days, she noted: This is not the first time we have [asked] Zach and others to not speak Spanish at school.
Given the reluctance of school officials to provide information, we may never know the full story, but Ms. Watts sounds like some of the paddle happy administrators and coaches who patrolled the halls when I was in Junior High School in the mid 50s. It was not uncommon for administrators and coaches to give Latinos licks for speaking Spanish in the halls.
So, she has asked the young man not to speak Spanish in the halls before. What gives her any right to make such a demand. Depending on how much trouble Ms. Watts has been in before for heavy handed discipline, a suitable punishment could range from verbal reprimand to termination. I definitely think she needs to complete some cultural diversity courses.
It also seems to me that Ms. Watts should have enough real discipline problems to occupy her time that she doesn't have to manufacture some of dubious nature.
Nothing should happen to the teacher if she reported the incident because of a direct order from Watts.
QUOTE(BoF @ Dec 10 2005, 02:52 PM)
It also seems to me that Ms. Watts should have enough real discipline problems to occupy her time that she doesn't have to manufacture some of dubious nature.
Did you happen to catch the name of this school? Endeavor Alternative School. I tried to look it up out of curiosity on http://www.greatschools.net and it wasn't even listed. My suspicion is Watts has much more than the usual share of discipline problems to deal with.
QUOTE(Mrs. Pigpen @ Dec 10 2005, 08:18 PM)
My suspicion is Watts has much more than the usual share of discipline problems to deal with.
That was exactly my point. She probably has enough discipline problems to deal with without getting bent out of shape because someone is speaking Spanish in the hall.
The whole story was he was speaking spanish or was it the lending the dollar?
This is a serious question...
If it was the language he was speaking then well, doesn't that violate Civil Rights?
Didn't people come to America to have "Freedom"?
This is a serious question...
If it was the language he was speaking then well, doesn't that violate Civil Rights?
Didn't people come to America to have "Freedom"?
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