I'd have put this in an "Arts" forum, but we don't have one (and I'm not saying we should, as we probably don't debate on Arts subjects enough to justify one).

Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince was the biggest selling book of 2005 in the USA (and most of the rest of the English-speaking world), topping an estimated 6.9 million copies in the US alone.

Apart from making J K Rowling even more fabulously wealthy - which I don't begrudge for an instant, what does this say about the modern world?

Is the success of Harry Potter, with it's occult subject matter, cause for any concern, as some Christians believe?

Do you think that, once the publicity machine, and J K Rowling herself, have moved on to the Next Big Thing, that the Harry Potter books (& films) will stand the test of time as great popular literature, or be looked back on (in 20 or 30 year's time) as a storm in a tea-cup, with thoughts of "why did we ever think these books were any good"?

For the record, I haven't read any of the HP books, though I've seen the first 3 films and enjoyed them well enough.

what does this say about the modern world? That there's still a special magic to be found in reading. What's especially interesting is that these books, based on Good vs. Evil, have obliterated the post-modern schlock that is dished out as juvenile "literature" today.

Is the success of Harry Potter, with it's occult subject matter, cause for any concern, as some Christians believe? As a Christian, I don't think so, but I do understand the reasons some others are concerned. I think they're mistaken.

Do you think that, once the publicity machine, and J K Rowling herself, have moved on to the Next Big Thing, that the Harry Potter books (& films) will stand the test of time as great popular literature, or be looked back on (in 20 or 30 year's time) as a storm in a tea-cup, with thoughts of "why did we ever think these books were any good"? I'm sure that the books and movies will stand the test of time as "very good popular literature." Great? Possibly. They are certainy the best juvenile literature to come along in 30+ years. There are two factors working against them being recognized anytime soon as "great." First, their size, which is less than friendly to bringing them into the educational environment, where "greatness" is conferred on literature. Second, the explicit way in which Good and Evil are treated, concepts that most modern educators are uncomfortable addressing.

Of course, if Lord Voldemort actually turns out to be Karl Rove, you'll see the academie hailing Rowling as the most brilliant writer of all time, if they can get past her whiteness.

A good story always stirs the soul. We are creatures who dream constantly and always wonder what if.


The Harry Potter books do well because of the characters--they are friends and that resonates with most people. I think it sticks for kids a bit more because your parents aren't really your friends and in the confusion of figuring out the world as it opens around you, kids often can feel like they can count on friends. You identify more at that time in your life than you ever will again.
They will survive--shakespeare--no, but like narnia and a the wind in the willows they hold a comfortable appeal that can survive both time and change in society.
As for any who still actually fear ghosts and goblins and magic and are afraid their child will suddenly become ensared by black magic--really kind of sad to even realize that you still exist in this world-- my best advice is to go sacrifice a chicken to Jobu to keep yourself safe and of course--and it should go without saying of course-- avoid being caught under the light of the full moon or you will go insane.

what does this say about the modern world?


I can't say it better than Bikerdad did, so I'll just say "Bravo, Bikerdad!"

Is the success of Harry Potter, with it's occult subject matter, cause for any concern, as some Christians believe?

Concern? I should say so, but the Christians who most loudly criticize the series don't seem to understand it, or even to have read it. The occultism presented is only fantasy magic, not the real stuff, but the struggle between good and evil in the stories is serious, and Potter is always on the side of good. In that respect the Harry Potter series is just like Narnia and just like LoTR. If anything, Christians (like myself) should be the biggest supporters of Harry Potter.

Do you think that, once the publicity machine, and J K Rowling herself, have moved on to the Next Big Thing, that the Harry Potter books (& films) will stand the test of time as great popular literature, or be looked back on (in 20 or 30 year's time) as a storm in a tea-cup, with thoughts of "why did we ever think these books were any good"?

Great popular literature? Not quite, but very good popular literature, and I think the series will be an enduring children's favorite.

I'd say that it shows that inspite of the wonders of technology, our kids can and will line up around city blocks to read a book at midnight.



After reading this question, I went and checked a few sources, here's one of them. I dont' buy the argument that the Potter books turn anyone on to witchcraft. Kids are creative and the author taps into that. I don't believe that kids want their own boiling pot and to stand around casting spells.



I'd say that in terms of children's literature, yes, these books will be classics-no question about that.

I have always wondered about the silly brouhaha that a small minority of Conervative Christians made over the supposedly 'occult' nature of this book. What occult nature exactly?

Yes, there is magic in it. Wizards and spellcasters and flying carpets and magic spells. I suppose I can see, if you stepped right out of the 17th century, how that could be considered occult and a 'danger to Christians'. On the other hand, there is just as much magic in 'Lord of the Rings', or countless other fantasy stories, including, by the way, 'The Chronicles of Narnia'. How is one 'A good Christian movie' and the other 'dangerous occult'? Both have stirring stories for children of good battling against evil, both have lessons of sacrifice and generosity, both show good eventually triumphs over evil. Both have magic, mystical creatures, spells and ancient sorcery.

I personally think that there is a section of the population that spends their entire life being indignant, and wander the world looking for things to be indignant about.

Apart from making J K Rowling even more fabulously wealthy - which I don't begrudge for an instant, what does this say about the modern world?

It tells me that fairy tales, if well-told, are still popular in this modern world. The nice thing about Rowling's books is that she puts young people with very real-life concerns and emotions into a fairy tale venue, and I am sure that many young readers can identify with the characters for that reason.

Is the success of Harry Potter, with it's occult subject matter, cause for any concern, as some Christians believe?

My pope thinks so. And I regret to say that I once made a very disparaging remark about him personally (which will not be repeated here) when I heard him putting down the Harry Potter books. But I don't think it is cause for concern.

Parents have the power (if anybody does) to control what their children are reading, watching on television, playing on their Game-Whatevers, or finding on the Internet. If they feel that their child is dwelling too much on a subject, whether it is magic, Japanese anime, or violent games; then it is their responsibility to require some balance in what the child is doing.

If they want to read their children a chapter out of the Bible, they can do that. But if they take the stories from (especially) the Old Testament:


Do you think that, once the publicity machine, and J K Rowling herself, have moved on to the Next Big Thing, that the Harry Potter books (& films) will stand the test of time as great popular literature, or be looked back on (in 20 or 30 year's time) as a storm in a tea-cup, with thoughts of "why did we ever think these books were any good"?

Barring the takeover of a theocratic dictatorship, I don't think that the Potter books will garner displeasure from future audiences. Whether or not we will still have books in their current form of bound paper, I think Harry Potter and his friends will still have a dedicated group of fans excited about passing the stories on to their children. Whether the children will be interested or not is anybody's guess.

I am with Julian in regards to the Harry Potter series. I have seen the movies and that is about it.

It kind of reminds me of the same type of discussions in the late 70s over Tolkein's books, which I did read back then and thoroughly enjoyed them.

This series is good for the young people. For one thing J K Rowling has managed to induce the people with a great story. The books appear to be well written, and they seem to push people in the use of vocabulary, and stimulates the imagination all at the same time. I think that each of those is admirable, and to do it at the same time is outstanding.

Hopefully these books will encourage more writers to treat our young readers with more respect and help them to achieve their potential.

what does this say about the modern world?

That kids are a good source of profits?

The fact that a children's book is successful is not surprising in the least. The fact that it is the #1 seller of 2005 (and was released mid-year) is simply a testimony to its popularity.

The characters are well-developed and likeable and have flaws just like real teenage kids. So children identify with the characters and want to know what happens in each sequel. It is simply well written fiction.

Another consequence is the many (many) copycat type books out there. My daughter likes the "Charlie Bone" series, although I found the character development rather weak and the plot so-so. My daughter keeps pestering me to read book four of the series, but I just don't have the interest that the HP series seems to evoke.

Is the success of Harry Potter, with it's occult subject matter, cause for any concern, as some Christians believe?

I have read all six released Harry Potter books and have seen all of the released movies. My kids own every Harry Potter video game they can get their hands on. There is nothing subversive or "occult" about the Harry Potter theme or storyline. It is fantasy mixed in a modern backdrop, which makes it closer to the reader.

Do you think that, once the publicity machine, and J K Rowling herself, have moved on to the Next Big Thing, that the Harry Potter books (& films) will stand the test of time as great popular literature, or be looked back on (in 20 or 30 year's time) as a storm in a tea-cup, with thoughts of "why did we ever think these books were any good"?

I think the good vs. evil plot device and the character development will make this series an enduring classic. It has the flawed hero (Harry Potter) who begins as an innocent schoolboy of age 10 and progresses to a teenager who is alternately confused by girls, perplexed by his enemies, and curious about his parents. The reader gets the sense that he is a real person and we care about what happens to him. That's the making of great literature.

It also helps that the movies were well-done (does anyone remember the old cartoon Lord of the Rings movies?). It gives a favorable start to those that haven't read the books (which are better by far than the movies).

Hold on a second now... you had better not be badmouthing Ralph Bakshi.

what does this say about the modern world?

That we are raising a generation of simpletons? I know I'm probably offending some people here, but these books, while restoring the lustre that reading has long lacked, are juvenile in every sense of the word. While they move from the childish to the moribund, they are still riddled with contrivances and depend on the familiarity of the reader to function as coherent narratives.

Call me crazy, but I think that is a problem. I've met plenty of kids who love Harry Potter, but are almost completely unable to pick up anything approaching a challenging novel that doesn't involve everyone's orphaned trickster. There's nothing nefarious in this, but it is still troubling.

By the age of twelve a child should be able to maneuvre a simple narrative without depending on familiar touchstones provided by movies and earlier, simpler books. Granted, this hasn't been the norm for quite some time; but these books are doing nothing to alleviate this failing of our child-rearing philosophy.

However, it isn't really J K Rowling's job to make up for inadequacies in a child's upbringing or education that produce a lack of curiosity in other, more serious literature that does not depend on contrivances.

I don't see J K Rowling as an educator, but a writer of children's books, pure and simple.

My oncologist refers to the series as "boilerplate," and I suppose that is an accurate description. Obviously, Rowling is not in the same league as JRR Tolkien.
But it is wildly popular series, and if it does compel some children to read who were otherwise uninterested, it is performing a service.

Your post excellently covered the points I was going to make.

But in regards to the ‘quoted’ comment: I think we expect to much intelligence from people who believe in superstition.

And there mere fact that these people are allowed near the levers of power is an indication that we and our freedom are in as great a threat from them as from other fundamentalists like bin Laden.

We only have to listen to the mad Ayatollah Roberson as he claimed that old age and its effects on Sharon’s health were sent from God.

It says that J.K. Rowling can write good books? What else would it say?



Some Christians are far too full of themselves and really don't know what their religion teaches. Nowhere in Harry Potter is there any sort of reference to Christian mythology such as hell, Satan, demons, etc. It's simply a non-issue, people jumping on the "it's not my religion, therefore it's evil" bandwagon, which really is pretty stupid when you think about it.

In the end, if they don't like the subject matter, don't read it. Simple as that.



The books are good, mostly because they don't talk down to kids and make them feel like idiots, or cater to the lowest common denominator. They show that actions have consequences and that sometimes, making the right decision isn't easy. I don't know that they'll become classics of Western Literature, but they're certainly entertaining to read and they make you think, which is a heck of a lot more than most kid's books do these days.