I don’t view Jerry Fallwell’s death through political or religions lenses.

Death is part of the life process. It is the great common denominator among humans. There's the old saying about "death and death and taxes.” While some among us avoid taxes, none of us escapes death.

I wish Falwell’s family and friends well.

Please try to keep this thread appropriately civil.

What is there to debate? Even Falwell would have agreed, it was the judgment of God!

TedN5, I started this in Casual Conversation rather than in a debate section. See your PMs.

I intentionally started it as a neutral thread. What others say about him is quite out of my jurisdiction.

Falwell’s so-called “Moral Majority” has been a blight on this country. His machinations to install Bush in the White House are reason enough to dislike the man and his organization.

But, it’s particularly ironic when you consider Falwell made hay in the 60’s preaching how politics should never mix with religion.

I guess he reconsidered when he realized how much money and power could be made by getting his sweaty hands into politics.

And then, who can forget this gem, quoted shortly after the 9/11 attacks:


He was a hateful man with a mean, crabbed spirit. About the only positive thing I can say about him is that at least he didn’t get caught up in any sleazy sex scandals, like so many of his brethren did. He won't be missed.

A wonderful man. He is now enjoying his just rewards. God bless you, Jerry.

Obviously the United States' acceptance of fundamentalist bigotry in all its' forms caused God to lift his veil of protection from the fat bastard's arteries. I'd offer my sympathy to his family, but if they have any shred of humanity, they are better off without him just like the rest of the world is.
There are very few people who are truly evil, Falwell was one of them. Pick an issue and he was in favor of hatred and bigotry. He hated Martin Luther King, he favored Apartheid*, he gloried in the death of people with AIDS, he was in agreement with Osama Bin Laden on the 9-11 attacks.

*Both of which views he supposedly disavowed while using the same ignorant, intellectually dishonest methods to promote hatred of gays that he'd earlier used to promote hatred of blacks. But them his fellow travelers in gay hating would have been with him at the time as well.

I had never heard of this man until I moved to the USA in '93.
Being surrounded by Americans, who are overwhelmigly open and friendly, I was shocked by this man's bigotry, hatred, and his drive to force his minority views onto others. Given an earlier post that reveals his diametric-hypocrasy, I suspect that this man was not driven by personal beliefs, but more by a market that made him rich.

The world has lost a bigot, and maybe a new one will be born soon. Enjoy the pause. The replacemanet will be a diferent kind of bigot, hating different people. Fallwell's kind are old and dying off. They will all be gone in 20 years. The next intelligent bigot will identify and exploit a market for his/her words that is new. And the media will love it.

It will come as no surprise that I am not in favor of just about any of the policies promoted by him. With that in mind, any death is a tragedy. I hope he did not suffer. I hope that those who loved him will endure their mourning with as little suffering as possible.

I hated him more than I hated Moynihan, who I also had no fond words for at his passing. The world is a better place when the likes of Falwell no longer walk the earth. I can say that I truely hope that he gets what he deserves.

I have had very strong feelings about Jerry Falwell for many, many years - as have millions of others. But in an effort to keep this inappropriately civil, I will simply quote Benazir Bhutto on the death of General Zia: "Who are we to question the will of God?"

To feign sorrow or sympathy for the passing of a man who displayed so little of either quality when he was alive is an act of moral cowardice and false sincerity and I will have nothing to do with any of it.

On the chance that someone on may feel differently, I will refrain from quoting directly some of Reverend Falwell's more---shall we say---provocative remarks. They are readily available for anyone wishing to seek them out.

However, I will say that I will mourn the death of Jerry Falwell about as much as he would mourn my death.

Not one teardrop. Not one minute. Not at all.

Wow! Two non-hateful responses, and one of those claiming "God's judgement". And yet, not a single one of you knows, or likely has even met Falwell. Nothing quite like diversity of opinion around here, eh?

Point to another modern public figure in America who has founded a university that enrolls 16,000 students? Sharpton? Jesse Jackson? Ellen Degeneres (sp?)? Rosie O'Donnell? Gloria Allred? Any other leading lights on the Left, Center or Right who've done so? didn't think so...

Falwell didn't pioneer political involvement based on religious principles, if so, then Martin Luther King, jr. is gonna be mighty surprised. Few of those decrying the Moral Majority's mixing of politics and faith seem bothered by King, Sharpton, Jackson, nor do Clinton's and Obama's appearances at churches arouse much concern.

Undoubtedly many of you will be mightily disappointed, but its far more likely that Falwell will get a "well done, good and faithful son" than an eternal introduction into the perspective of a campfire marshmallow. And at 73 years old, its not as if his passing is unusual...

Just happen to be reading C. S. Lewis, Mere Christianity, as part of a gig. For Christians, or at least the kind that Lewis describes, death is not a tragic event. However, the loss of a loved one is undeniably tragic. For the friends and family of Jerry Falwell, my sincere sympathy. Been there, done that, there ain't no T-shirt.

I accept many parts of Christianity into my brecciated spirituality, and one is not to judge others. Oh, I can judge the behavior, but not the core part, the soul, the consciousness, the deepest part, the only stuff you get to take along, the character. I might consider someone's thinking to be muddled beyond imagination, or worse, square into imagination. I pretty much know where Mr. Falwell was coming from, and I handily reject such a position.

When one of my older brothers passed at the young age of 53, one of the things that came in was that he would miss some insane things to come. Yep, that was right on the mark. He went out in 1998, so missed the 2000 elections, 9/11 and the Iraq project. He wasn't very political, but he got upset when things went very wrong. Big heart there, probably too big for his own good and not well accepted in this world.

Someone pointed out that we posters never met Jerry Falwell, and that's very true for me. I don't seek out the company of people like that. So, on the emotional level, I neither love nor hate the man, now the spirit. But I can feel something, and that is pity for the soul. It's the same kind of pity I feel for my dead brother. I don't think either had much of a chance here on Earth. I'm pretty sure that Mr. Falwell came from a sort of idealism, as I am sure that my brother did. This is certainly not an ideal world, nor is it a horrible world. It's both. There are moments in time.

Lewis was writing when World War II was still fresh in people's minds. He wrote about forgiveness, about loving one's neighbor no matter how big of a jerk that neighbor might be. He wondered if the Jewish people could ever forgive the Nazis, and he decided that it's probably too much for most. I agree. Genocide is something beyond me to forgive. But I can find forgiveness for Mr. Jerry Falwell. He offended me, but not that much.

Now it's up to Jerry's God to figure out where he went right and where he went wrong, when he showed character and when he did not. Actually, I agree with Lewis on this one: Character cannot be hidden from God. All the trappings of the earthly existence fall away at death.

I suppose I could wish the best for my brother and Mr. Falwell, but when you think about it, that's meaningless now. It is what it shall be, and that's that. I can only wish the best for the living, so that's what I'm doing.

Apparently after something like a 15 year feud that spilled over into the courts he and Larry Flynt became buds. Now that is reaching across the aisle. However, unlike MLK I can't think of any serious good Falwell added to the world. Of course I didn't hang with the dude. As I understand it he believed in his own very peculiar version of Christianity and along with that came an assurance that anyone who didn't believe like him was going to hell. You wonder how a seriously bright guy gets to such a screwy place.

I'd be inclined to call him a blot on the culture accept for one thing. You don't know if the collection of odd fellows that followed him might not have latched on to somebody worse if he didn't show up on the scene. Father Coughlan and Billy James Hargis come to mind.

It would be ironic if Jesus (if he existed at all) actually turned out to be a homosexual. Certainly, Christ’s universal message of love cannot be true unless it embraces all mankind, and not just a few self-righteous bigots.

Thank you for the quotation, DaffyGrl. Clearly it isn't just women who are known for changing their minds.

The man probably had good intentions when he started out. Only God knows if Falwell's actions made more enemies than converts to his particular brand of Christianity. I'm not sure that what the man engendered was hatred for certain groups of people but I am certain about the intolerance.

Some day, if what some of us believe is correct, we will all stand in judgment before God and answer for what we have said and done. Maybe we'll know one day what God really thought of Jerry Falwell and his "Moral Majority" and the actual effect of his influence on our country. Regardless, I hope that his mourners will find peace. The man did live a long, full life, and he certainly had his say.

It is said: “Politics makes for strange bedfellows.” Certainly, there can be no more queer ones than religion and politics.

And you have? If not then what was the point of this statement?



Yes, falwell created a University which teaches misinformation and ignorance among its top courses, preaching 'young-earth' creationism, firing its staff (all nontenured) if they dare break from religious principles, expelling students for such activities as 'signing unauthorised petitions' or entering the room of a person (on or off campus) of the opposite gender, and generally ranking at the bottom of every national University ranking. The university was FOUNDED on bank fraud and was in fact charged by the US securities and Exchange Comission, which forced it into bankruptcy in its first incarnation. It also went nearly-bankrupt in the mid 1990s, before being bailed out by Reverend Sun Myung Moon, the rabidly anti-American cult leader who believes himself to be the incarnation of Christ. I guess Falwell didn't really care where the money was coming from, as long as he got his hands on the money.

Now to be fair, it does have a fairly good female athletics program...



Actually I think the main issue is the hypocricy of a man preaching for a decade that politics and faith should not intermingle, and then getting into entirely political work and becoming exceptionally wealthy in the process. I think it the kind of corruption that has Falwell raise 3.2 million dollars in donations for an African Charity, of which only about 300,000 actually made it to Africa, the rest was misappropriated by him and his staff. The man who said feminists were just crazy lesbians in need of a good man: the man who said the Teletubies were gay icons and should be boycotted, the man who blamed pagans, feminists, agnostics and gays for 9/11

"AIDS is not just God's punishment for homosexuals; it is God's punishment for the society that tolerates homosexuals"

"I listen to feminists and all these radical gals - most of them are failures. They've blown it. Some of them have been married, but they married some Casper Milquetoast who asked permission to go to the bathroom. These women just need a man in the house. That's all they need. Most of the feminists need a man to tell them what time of day it is and to lead them home. And they blew it and they're mad at all men. Feminists hate men. They're sexist. They hate men - that's their problem"



Were I believer I would say that is pretty spectacularily unlikely. Saying "God" and "Christ" a lot does not make you holy, your actions define you not your rhetoric, and Falwell's actions speak for themselves.


Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't 'wish him dead' in that I don't wish anyone dead. But I certainly don't see any particular reason to get personally choked up by his passing.

One need not have ever met Hitler in order to have an opinion about him, and if there was little diversity of the opinion, would another question it?


Hitler did much for the people of Germany of the time, one's few good or bad actions do not outweigh the totatlity of a person's lifelong actions and impact. When Sharpton and Jackson keel over I'll nave no kind words for them either, although persons of color might praise them for their contributions to the causes of that particular race, again, the totality of their life's actions is the measure by which I will make my comments. Helping your own, and those who will in turn help you, is hardly why I consider a noble gesture.


When the next Democratic president get dialy calls from Jackson or Sharpton and passes decision past them for their input, then I think you can make the comparison, and I will join you in decrying both them and whoever that president is.


If Hitler truely believed that what he was doing was divinely ordained, will he not be sitting at the right hand of god?

Um, just about every private university in the country? John Sperling of the University of Phoenix comes to mind. As does the Otis Institute (founder of the LA Times Harrison Otis). And Carnegie Mellon, whose H. John Heinz III School of Public Policy and Management was founded by…you guessed it, Teresa Kerry’s first husband (H. John Heinz III).

Many other religious private universities are more worthy of admiration than Falwell’s propaganda school (Chapman, Occidental and Claremont Colleges all come to mind, just in my state). Oh, let’s not forget that Oral Roberts has his own propaganda school, too (or has it gone belly up?).

I'm with Jimmy Carter on this one.

(Of course, McCain later made nice with Falwell, knowing he needed his support for his 2008 campaign for president.)

I don't call a school that indoctrinates rather opens mind a university.

Liberty University is not alone in this. Several years ago Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary in Fort Worth fired its President, Russell Dilday. There were thirty-eight board members in charge of the seminary at the time. I started a joke about this. Q: "What does it take to fire a Dilday?" A: "Thirty-eight dildos." In years since Dilday's dismissal Southwetern has purged it's faculty of moderate voices and even fired a highly rated woman professor because those in charge didn't think women should be in charge of instructing potential male pastors.



Other than saying death isn’t unusual for someone 73-years-old, I don’t agree

As others have written, I thought Fallwell's words were often atrocious. Unlike others, I see death has brutal, final reality. I may be wrong, but I don't think any of us gets a second chance in another life. Let Donte's Inferno be relegated to classic literature.

Falwell's legacy is set in stone - intolerance. Death does not change that, I don’t think time will change it either. In afterlife, he will exit between the pages of mid 20th to early 20th century history. While recognizing his efforts in getting "Christian" voters to the polls, historians will not be kind to Falwell. There, however, is no reason to wish that he burn in hell. In my opinion, that's not likely to happen to any of us.

Wishing his family well is another matter. Nobody is responsible for the bad behavior of another adult.

“There have been no sects in the christian world, however absurd, which have not endeavoured to support their opinions by arguments drawn from Scripture, misinterpreted or misapplied.

“We had a melancholy instance of this in our own country, in the last century, - when the church of Christ, as well as the government, during that period of national confusion, was torn asunder into various sects and factions; - when some men pretended to have Scripture precepts, parables, or prophecies to plead, in favor of the most impious absurdities that falsehood could advance. The same spirit which prevailed amongst the fanaticks, seems to have gone forth among these modern enthusiasts. - Faith, the distinguishing characteristic of a christian, is defined by them not as a rational assent of the understanding, to truths which are established by indisputable authority, but as a violent persuasion of mind, that they are instantaneously become the children of God - that the whole score of their sins is for ever blotted out, without the payment of one tear of repentance. - Pleasing doctrine this to the fears and passions of mankind! - promising fair to gain proselytes of the vicious and impenitent.”

- Laurence Sterne, “On Enthusiasm,”Sermons of the late Rev. Sterne, V-VII, Sermon 11 (1769)

. . .

Evangelical Christians represent the glorification of form over substance. They profess true faith, but fall far short in its practice. They give you words - "airy nothings" - when deeds, not words, are needed. They are not true Christians, and they make a mockery of Christ's teachings. They are the bane of goodness, and would pray their way to heaven on credit than pay with good works. They are pious frauds. Theirs is a peculiar form of hypocrisy that pretends to scruples while abusing them without shame.

I met the man personally -several times. Personally charismatic- but evil nevertheless.

it is very hard not to speak ill of the dead, especially if you have ever been to a NON-televissed sermon at a small regional church (that, of course, spent MANY thousand of dollars in "donations" to have him speak- local church here was chargd 30 grand per sunday)

His university is a farce, not quite as bad as Bob Jones university, but dang close.

It is hard to find a more evil person in use history than this guy.

The so-called “religious right,” composed of Christian fundamentalists (evangelical fanatics) and extremists, have hijacked the Republican party. They are not Christians, but the worst kind of political subversives. They are unethical and intellectually dishonest, their professed beliefs a perversion of Christ’s teachings, and their practices a corruption of the most basic tenets of Christian faith. They are anathema. It is they - not the Moslem terrorists - that pose the greatest threat to American democracy.

The Dominionists - these Christians of bowels who would presume to pass judgment on the morals of the age - will be their own undoing; for it is they who have pushed the Republicans far from their traditional conservative values in order to impose their own radical agenda on the nation and the world. They shall succeed only in alienating true conservatives and causing a rift in the Republican party; which, ultimately, shall result in their political downfall - as witness the last midterm election.

Wow. Well, I wasn't a fan of Falwell's either, but I don't really have anything to say upon his passing other than best wishes to his family and friends. I hope that I would be above some of this if, God forbid, one of our leading secular fanatics were to pass away. Thanks for starting the thread anyway, BoF!

Sounds like some of you might like to hear the moderate, open-minded comments of John Edwards' ex-webmistress, Amanda Marcotte. The comments there make this look like a church social.

Pandagon - The gates of hell swing open and Satan welcomes his beloved son

If that were to happen we could point to good as well as bad things they had done in their life to evaluate the impact they had on the world. In Falwell's case there is no good to point to, the man was a bigot and the world is better off without him.
The man was a prime mover in turning religion in the United States from a force for good to a force for evil. He did Satan's work while he lived.

We remember people for how they lived. What could be a more fitting tribute to a man who dedicated his life to spreading hatred than to remember him for it.
If we can't say good riddance to bad rubbish we can't say anything true about the man.

Much like the other sweeping judgements that you so often render here, this was delivered competely irony-free. I don't know how you do it with a straight face. Pretty funny stuff.

Name something positive the man ever did. Was he a force for good when he spread hatred and lies against Martin Luther King? When he supported Apartheid? Maybe you think setting up a diploma mill to load the current administration with underqualified religious fanatics was a good thing?

Remember the man for what he was, good and bad (in this case, there is no good). That's all I'd want for myself or anyone I admire.

I suppose you think it's oh so ironic to hate and decry a man for spreading hatred. Because naturally hating people who attack you is exactly the same as hating people who do you no harm. I guess we shouldn't hate Osama Bin Ladin either.

Grendel72 are you using the word "Satan" figuratively or literally?

If you are using it literally, then you fall into the same trap as Falwell.

I didn't care much for Falwell either, but we don't have evoke a supernatural figure with horns and a tail to say that on balance Falwell's accomplishments lie on the negative side.

There is little value in fighting perceived hatred with more hatred. It's a battle nobody wins.

Edited to add:

This is how I think social, cultural and intellectual historians will evaluate Falwell twenty or thirty years from now.

1. There is no denying that he was influential in building religions conservatives into a potent voting force. Without this influence Reagan would have won both his races as would George H. W. Bush in 1988. Due to the closeness of both the 2000 and 2004 elections, I don’t George W. Bush would have won without this force. In my opinion, this in itself is a negative. I think the impact of religious conservatives as a voting block was waning even as Falwell's death was announced. There doesn't seem to be one of the current crop of ten Republicans they like. If Pat Robertson had died yesterday, the posts on this thread could be easily interchanged. Yet at this moment, Robertson's voice is diminishing as those of people like Rick Warren are increasing.

2. Historians will look at Falwell's many bigoted statements. They will see this as the work of a man futily attempting to turn the hands of the clock backwards, that is out of the main stream.

3. Liberty University will be mentioned in passing, but not given the prestige that UVA, founded by Thomas Jefferson, is given.

In short, Falwell will be seen as an influential figure in the mid to late 20th to early 21st century – influential but more pathetic than great.

I think you mean, CW, that the irony is in having "bigotry" towards a bigot? While I don't want to get too technical, is it possible to be a "bigot" against only one person or must a class of people be involved?

Anyway, I can't say I'm particularly sad or happy this man has died. I only knew him from his TV appearances and having lived near Lynchburg, VA. He certainly had intolerant positions towards classes of people so I'm certainly not surprised that there are people who are happy about his death. I guess you "reap what you you sow."

Quite literally he was instrumental in turning the Christian faith in the United States against the actual teachings of Christ. He used religion to promote racism, sexiam, anti-semitism, homophobia, etc... Jesus had an answer when asked "who is my neighbor," Falwell dedicated his professional life to denying that answer.
Quite literally for anyone who believes in what Falwell claimed to it is obvious he was working for the other side.

Grendel72, this is only a valid point of view if someone believes in supernatural forces. In my thinking devils are mere superstition. I understand your dislike of Falwell, (in fact I share much of it) but I reject your "devil" with the same contempt I dismiss his version of "god."

Well, yeah. You always strike me as someone who is very hateful, at least based on your posts here. I find that you would decry "spreading hatred" ironic.

Bin Laden has killed thousands, and Falwell at his worst has supported a failing, racist government and started "a diploma mill." (which is apparently fully accredited to award associate, bachelor, master and doctoral degrees...) Hating the man's ideas is fine. Hating the man just seems spiteful and petty.


I'm not too sure about the definition, but no matter. Grendel72 has a class of people in mind--it's not just Falwell.

Hating people who make their life's work the misery of others is not a bad thing. Nobody is born a bigot. If it makes you feel good to defend a man who attacked Martin Luther King, as it does to defend Ann Coulter on various occasions, I think that speaks for itself.
Personally, I'd say it is disgusting to whine about people being upset by bigots when you never speak against the bigots. At the very least it indicates where your true heart lies. It's amazing how delicate your sensibilities are as long as it doesn't involve calling people nigger or faggot.

Religion can be a force for good. Certainly the actual teachings of Christ should always be associated with doing right by your fellow man. Somehow Falwell and his ilk never understood that, preferring to spread hatred and lies while extorting money from pensioners to build Earthly monuments to themselves.

Ya, well, an athiest told me to go to hell once- I told him to re-check his manual- don't think he can do that

However- since it was brought up that his "school" was/is "accredited"- how in the world do you give a bachelor's degree in scienc while ignoring so much actual science- since they are teaching creationism, last I checked, in thier "science" classes as a scientifically viable option to ACTUAL science?

Like I said,I met the man personally. I heard him preach FOR south african aparthied, head him personally preach about how MLK "is an apostate, a communist, a womanizer and a subversive in our society that is a blight on all good poeple of this land" etc etc/

Also heard him say IN PERSON "gays would just as soon kill you as look at you"- I heard him say it, in person, in church that my folks made me attend.

So yeah, Grendel, who has professed to be homosexual, has every right to hate a guy that has spread so much hate about him.

There is very, very little difference between Jerry Falwel and Bob Jones and Robert Phelps (who graduated from Bob Jones- oh, don't know who Bob Phelps is? Check out his protesting of funerals with signs "god hates fags")

I grew up around this man, his tapes were required watching in my house, and attended schools with his curiculum in it- you could say I am the resident expert on the man, and have met him face to face on a couple-four occasions or so.

That's a really good point. According to the website they hand out B.S. in Biology... I'm utterly speechless, I mean they *can't* be ignoring evolution in Biology classes, or can they? Yikes.

Actually- they condemn evolution as "psuedo science that pollutes good science" when I asked that question, years ago. They SERIOUSLY deride any science that claims the earth was/is over 6000 years old!

CR, "science" is a pretty broad category, as is "biology". You can obtain a degree in musical theory without knowing the full history behind the creation of the acoustical guitar. I don't remember taking any classes pertaining to the evolution of man myself, and I obtained a biology minor at a public university. Of course it was a long time ago so I might have forgotten...and my minor was microbiology, but whatever. I took a deluge of "science" courses, and obtained a Chemistry degree/microbiology minor, then medical technology degree...all without studying the evolution of man!

Well, to remain on topic, I suppose I have to say something about the passing of Falwell.

I really didn't like this man and can't come up with much. I don't think this was a "judgement from God". If so, well, we're all judged accordingly aren't we? None of us are getting out of this world alive. I do wish the best for his family.

The televangelists - the Pat Robertson’s and Jerry Falwell’s of this world - don’t practice what they preach, and their so-called ministries make a mockery of religion. They are “ranters” like the character “Talkative” in John Bunyon’s The Pilgrim’s Progress.

I do have to wonder at this point. Bof specifically asked for civility on this thread. There are two choices: 1. Say nothing 2. Say something respectful.

Thus far, most of the posts are rants about one thing or another, with the sole intent of bashing Falwell. Is it that hard to be civil or simply say nothing?

This post says nothing, as requested.

Ultimately those of you who hate, disapprove or are wishing ill upon this man's soul are only doing what he ever really wanted - giving him attention.

I will remain civil by posting nothing*.

*well except for the post to say that I have posted nothing. I only posted nothing to remain civil. However, I suppose by posting about posting nothing I have posted something. I wonder if it is civil... Oh well as long as I don't hit Add Reply everything will be fi

There is a big difference with being civil and being complimentary. I laid into Falwell in my first post to be sure, but was very civil about it. If the point of the thread had been 'don't post anything unless you plan to post something complimentary about falwell', then the thread would be very short indeed.

The fact is Falwell was a bad man, whose contribution to this world has been, on the whole, a negative one. Even his 'charity drives' were out-and-out frauds, with charitable donations lining his own pockets and those of his staffers as opposed to going to those in need. How can you describe that as anything but contemptible? I won't go so far as some as to say he was pure evil or everything he did was wrong, I don't think that's possible. But certainly on the whole none here can say his life left an overall positive impact.


Civility does not require obsequiousness, and two civil people can still disagree wholeheartedly, just as people can, in a very civil manner, point out the evil done by other men.

“My mother always told me that no matter how much you dislike a person, when you meet them face to face you will find characteristics about them that you like. Jerry Falwell was a perfect example of that. I hated everything he stood for, but after meeting him in person, years after the trial, Jerry Falwell and I became good friends. He would visit me in California and we would debate together on college campuses. I always appreciated his sincerity even though I knew what he was selling and he knew what I was selling.”

--Larry Flynt, Publisher, Hustler Magazine

When you are dealing with a person who was as swinish and loutish as Jerry Falwell, the answer to the question is clearly, "yes." Yes, it is hard to be civil about someone who brought so much incivility to the world. To say nothing but respectful things about someone like Falwell is saying nothing that is honest or truthful.

There's this quaint little notion that once someone dies we should be "respectful," and ignore their failings in life. Say nothing but good things of the dead because one day we all will join their ranks seems to be the unspoken code in effect. However, some of us believe we should bury Falwell with his sins recounted as well as praise him for his virtues.

If you were a mean and sweaty little thug like Falwell whose career was devoted to spreading division and intolerance, why should those of us "left behind" now speak only nice things of him or forever hold our peace? When Al Sharpton, Rush Limbaugh, Fidel Castro, or anyone else that is a lightning rod of controversy shuffles off to the Choir Invisible, no consensus will be reached on whether their passage is a good or bad thing. What makes Falwell the exception?

BoF's call for civility is well-intentioned, but it is difficult to apply to a thug like Falwell. I did not like him in life and he smells no sweeter to me now in death. Whether it's Jerry Falwell or Ronald Reagan or Coretta Scott King, threads on the passage of famous and infamous men and women draw both those who are respectfully saddened by their transition while others will say, "I'm glad the rascal is finally gone." That's the way it is and that's the way it should be.

This place is called America's Debate, not America Agrees. The debate doesn't always end with unanimity.

I find it ever so ironic that you post things like this when you have a quote on your signature that states:


Frankly, being a Christian, I did see fault in some of the things that Falwell did and said. However, he did make an attempt to quell the overwhelming advance of pornography and other parts of American society that stand to the left of decency. Maybe he wasn't someone to look up to, but he surely wasn't all of the terrible things that are being written.

I definitely am not standin' up for some of the really "out there" things that Falwell believed, but frankly it's not surprising that you make such outlandish and seemingly angry comments about a very conservative white man. Par for the course in my opinion... whatever that's worth.

What does Jerry Falwell being a "very conservative White man" have to do with anything? What is your hang-up that you always have to look through the prism of race when you're responding/ranting/frothing at the mouth to one of my posts? Seems you've got some anger issues of your own to work out there, fella.

And if you liked the Thoreau quote, you're gonna love the Asimov quote.

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