Full Version: Giuliani's Kerik corruption problem
This issue has been in the news as of late, and it makes for one heck of a story. Truth is stranger than fiction and this entire story is no exception. 
Bernard Kerik's rise and fall has been linked very closely to Giuliani. It definitely wouldn't have ever happened without Giuliani's help. Half of Giuliani's cabinet opposed Kerik's appointment as NYPD chief. Kerik lacked a college degree, a requirement that somehow got exempted in Kerik's case.
Add to that the notion that he was promoted simply due to being Giuliani's personal driver and body guard, and the questions only contniue to mount. A rather interesting list of accusations cropped up after Kerik withdrew his name for consideration to follow in Tom Ridge's steps. Among them listed by wikipedia:
The article to read about all of that can be found here.
Questions for debate:
1.)Was it possible for Giuliani to not know about the many problems of his friend until after the fact? What evidence suggests that this would, or would not be, the case?
2.)Will the Kerik affair hurt Giuliani's chances to be president?
3.)What does the Kerik affair say about Giuliani's decision making ability?
Bernard Kerik's rise and fall has been linked very closely to Giuliani. It definitely wouldn't have ever happened without Giuliani's help. Half of Giuliani's cabinet opposed Kerik's appointment as NYPD chief. Kerik lacked a college degree, a requirement that somehow got exempted in Kerik's case.
Add to that the notion that he was promoted simply due to being Giuliani's personal driver and body guard, and the questions only contniue to mount. A rather interesting list of accusations cropped up after Kerik withdrew his name for consideration to follow in Tom Ridge's steps. Among them listed by wikipedia:QUOTE
Shortly after withdrawal of the nomination, the press reported on several other incidents which might also have posed difficulties in gaining confirmation by the Senate. These include: questions regarding Kerik's sale of stock in Taser International shortly before the release of an Amnesty International report critical of the company's stun-gun product; a sexual harassment lawsuit; an affair with Judith Regan; allegations of misuse of police personnel and property for personal benefit; connections with a construction company suspected of having ties to organized crime; and failure to comply with ethics rules on gifts
The article to read about all of that can be found here.
Questions for debate:
1.)Was it possible for Giuliani to not know about the many problems of his friend until after the fact? What evidence suggests that this would, or would not be, the case?
2.)Will the Kerik affair hurt Giuliani's chances to be president?
3.)What does the Kerik affair say about Giuliani's decision making ability?
These state charges against Kerik are old news. He has pleaded guilty to them and is now under indictment for federal crimes. Some of the information for these indictments probably came from one of his former mistresses, Judith Regan. She has now sued Murdoch's News Corporation and has accused one of its executives of pressuring her to make false statements to the FBI to protect Giuliani. (See Democracy Now Article.)
In any rational democracy this evidence would be enough to sink any candidacy. Given our corporate controlled media and propaganda machines, Giuliani may still survive.
QUOTE
On Tuesday, it was revealed that one of Kerik's former lovers, Judith Regan, had sued Rupert Murdoch's News Corp and accused the company of pressuring her to commit perjury in order to protect Giuliani's presidential ambition. Last year, Regan was fired as head of ReganBooks in the controversy over aborted plans to publish a book by O.J. Simpson. In a wrongful termination suit, Regan says an executive at News Corp pressured her to lie to investigators about her affair with Kerik.
In any rational democracy this evidence would be enough to sink any candidacy. Given our corporate controlled media and propaganda machines, Giuliani may still survive.
1.)Was it possible for Giuliani to not know about the many problems of his friend until after the fact? What evidence suggests that this would, or would not be, the case?
Possible? Anything's possible. I doubt it though. Kerik has had such an astronomical rise in power with Giuliani's help over the years, and appearingly unmerited
to boot, that I find it very hard to believe that Giuliani didn't know who Kerik really was. The whole thing almost stinks of blackmail.
3.)What does the Kerik affair say about Giuliani's decision making ability?
I think that it just points to what a lot of us already suspect. That Giuliani is a slick dealing politician who puts himself and his friends above the voters.
[/quote]
Possible? Anything's possible. I doubt it though. Kerik has had such an astronomical rise in power with Giuliani's help over the years, and appearingly unmerited
to boot, that I find it very hard to believe that Giuliani didn't know who Kerik really was. The whole thing almost stinks of blackmail.
3.)What does the Kerik affair say about Giuliani's decision making ability?
I think that it just points to what a lot of us already suspect. That Giuliani is a slick dealing politician who puts himself and his friends above the voters.
[/quote]
Giuliani might be able to eek his way through to the nomination despite his more moderate/liberal record by playing up his alleged 9/11 leadership role. What makes it very difficult is this whole Kerik fiasco. Romney is using it as the icing on the cake in regards to giving Giuliani the business.
WaPo article.
I honestly don't see how he can make it through a mud fight in the primaries, let alone doing it again in the general election against the Hill.
QUOTE
He then proceeded to link Giuliani to Clinton on abortion, gay rights and immigration, and ended with tough words for the former mayor's support for former New York police commissioner Bernard B. Kerik to be secretary of homeland security. Kerik, a longtime friend and confidant of Giuliani's, was recently indicted on multiple corruption charges.
"I believe it's important for someone to be pro-life, to be pro-family and pro-traditional marriage, to be in favor of legal immigration but against illegal immigration and to have a record of insisting on the highest ethical standards, and I'm afraid that on all four of those measures that Mayor Giuliani would be the wrong course for our party," Romney said. "He is in the same position as Hillary Clinton on life and on marriage and on the ethical history of his administration, and also on sanctuary cities and immigration policy."
"I believe it's important for someone to be pro-life, to be pro-family and pro-traditional marriage, to be in favor of legal immigration but against illegal immigration and to have a record of insisting on the highest ethical standards, and I'm afraid that on all four of those measures that Mayor Giuliani would be the wrong course for our party," Romney said. "He is in the same position as Hillary Clinton on life and on marriage and on the ethical history of his administration, and also on sanctuary cities and immigration policy."
WaPo article.
I honestly don't see how he can make it through a mud fight in the primaries, let alone doing it again in the general election against the Hill.
The Libertarian, Justin Raimondo, posted an interesting column on this today. He makes it clear that the issue is much broader than simple political corruption. (See Raimondo Article)
QUOTE
The Kerik case has all the ingredients of a real courtroom potboiler: money, illicit sex, political corruption, and, quite possibly, an attempt to unduly influence U.S. operations in Iraq on behalf of a foreign power. Perhaps our somnolent press corps will wake up long enough to ask Rudy if he can shed any light on these matters.
QUOTE(nebraska29 @ Nov 26 2007, 07:47 AM) 
I honestly don't see how he can make it through a mud fight in the primaries, let alone doing it again in the general election against the Hill.
Well, the 'Hill' is going to get 47% (what Kerry got) to 55% of the vote no matter who the nominee is. Of course the outcome is determined in that small span. But you're right, the dirty is stacking up on Rudy. Having 3 different wives turn a lot of people off to start with and when you start throwing these abuse of power cases in front of the public, it can turn people flat out against him or put them into to no vote status which is what the Republicans have to fear most. Between Kerik, his constant judicial activism of suing the federal and state governments over everything from illegal immigrants to taxes, and now his use of the NYPD for his mistresses...it doesn't look good right now.
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