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Victoria Silverwolf
There seems to be a growing trend towards requiring school uniforms in public schools. (I avoid private schools here; I suppose they can require any rules they like. I do wonder, however, why private girls' schools often seem to make the students wear sexy miniskirts . . . I also avoid the issue of whether there should be public schools at all.)

Is this a helpful thing? Does it reduce conflict among students based on their ability to wear the latest fashions? Does it allow them to concentrate on school work?

Or is it a useless restriction on individuality? Does it create an atmosphere of regimentation and repression?

I always went to public schools and never had a uniform, so I cannot speak from experience. My feeling is that I would greatly resent such a policy. Reasonable "dress codes" (no clothing which creates an obvious disruption of the classroom) seem to be enough. (I never saw anybody who did not wear perfectly acceptable clothing to school, in my experience.)
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Mrs. Pigpen
I think that student uniforms are a great idea, personally.
It is a LOT cheaper for the parents, and eliminates the economic appearance disparity (I can't think of a better phraseology).
GoAmerica
I'm against it because it is against Freedom of Expression
quarkhead
QUOTE(goamerica @ Mar 29 2003, 03:04 PM)
I'm against it because it is against Freedom of Expression

Are you also against work-based dress codes?

Most public schools also have dress codes anyway. There are things you can't wear to school. What about the kid who wore the "Bush in the crosshairs" Tshirt? A lot of schools ban suggestive clothing. Should we get rid of all those standards as well? Or is abrogating the freedom of expression ok in some ways, but not in others? Why can't I wear a thong to work? Why can't I go to school naked for that matter? It's freedom of expression.

I think that sometimes we get so caught up in the veneer of our freedoms that we lose sight of their roots. People will argue a point like this to death, and meanwhile ignore many of the more serious abrogations of liberty being enacted in the White House and in the Corporate board rooms. Remember the kid who was suspended for wearing a Pepsi shirt on the school Coca Cola picture day? Now that is a real problem in regards to fredom of expression. The school had signed a contract with Coca Cola. So a kid gets suspended for not displaying brand loyalty (everyone else was wearing Coca Cola shirts).

Blech.
nighttimer
sleep.gif My son attends a junior high school that requires a school uniform.

Personally, I like it. It's a lot easier and cheaper to buy white, blue and grey shirts and black or blue slacks than have to worry about the latest Sean Jean and FUBU gear.

School should be about academics and education. I could care less about the fashion aspect.

Conformity and uniformity in dress in no way threatens the individuality of a kid. They just have to find another way to express it than stylin' and profilin' in designer clothes.
Adrian
What about the 1st amendment?
Freedom of expression?
...lack of conformity...
Uniforms are all about making all the kids the same... Hey, why don't we just get rid of names? Numbers are easier. We'll give them numbers.
Geez! I go to a public high school... If they made us wear uniforms I would fight it tooth and nail. I'd be getting suspenstions (and fighting those too, since courts have ruled due process is required to give out suspension) left and right but I would not wear the uniform. And since I have no behaviour record (although I'm sure they're monitoring.my.politics) that would be puzzling for them, would't it? It's not ok and it's not right. It's just another step... towards throwing individuality out the window...
Abs like Jesus
I went to private school for 12 years (with exception of one semester)... and endured dress codes for every one of them.

I won't necessarily say they are a bad thing, but I don't think they really serve any greater purpose. In my experience, the students I went to school with and the friends I had from public school didn't behave any differently in school because of the way they dressed. We certainly didn't pay any more attention in class just because we were dressed to match.

Some kids don't have a problem with dress codes while others feel stifled. I don't personally know of any kids who just want to have one. If I had to choose I would go without a strict dress code, though maintaining perhaps some code of decency (read: no underwear or nudity) while in class. I'd like to see a degree of objectionable material allowed ("Bush in the crosshairs," whatever), too. I think situations like that don't disrupt class but provide an able teacher with a wonderful chance to teach and shape our youth.

Some of you have brought up what I feel might be one good defense of school uniforms: economic disparity. But parents, whether able or unable, shouldn't feel obliged to buy the latest designs and fashions. And unless we're to bring our children up materialistically and geared towards conformity (EVERYBODY wearing the same trend...), they shouldn't even want them.

At any rate, I'll stand against school uniforms. smile.gif
Adrian
In private schools, uniforms are fine.
You choose to go there.
But you can wear whatever the hell you want to a public school.
If you honestly feel the need to be up on the "latest trends," then you seriously need to grow up. A lot of my clothes ceme from thrift stores. Thrift stores are the best. wub.gif
Jaime
QUOTE(Adrian @ Apr 2 2003, 01:25 AM)
What about the 1st amendment?
Freedom of expression?
...lack of conformity...

It might help the debate if you read some of the posts in this thread before you post. The "freedom of expression" argument was made by goamerica and responded to by quarkhead. Do you have any rebuttal for that or were you looking to rehash what people have already said here? wink2.gif

(and yes, thrift shops ARE best - I still exclusively shop in them AND I have a dress code to adhere to at work biggrin.gif )
Mrs. Pigpen
QUOTE(Adrian @ Apr 2 2003, 12:27 PM)
In private schools, uniforms are fine.
You choose to go there.
But you can wear whatever the hell you want to a public school.
If you honestly feel the need to be up on the "latest trends," then you seriously need to grow up. A lot of my clothes ceme from thrift stores. Thrift stores are the best.  wub.gif

It's great you shop in thrift stores.

You know who doesn't think it's great to shop thrift? The kids who HAVE to, or should. One of the primary insults a student would say to another in the school I taught at (underprivileged, lower income) was 'You shop at Walmart'. Maybe they need to 'grow up', but that's part of the whole process of, well...growing up, isn't it?
Clothing- whether it's style, designer label, or quality, shouldn't be an issue at school.
Google
Adrian
Well, if you have the sort of friends who will make fun of you for where you shop, they aren't friends... Wal-mart is cool, they have the greatest belts. Anybody asks, my choice of store is the Salvation Army or Unique Thrift and I really couldn't care less what they have to say about that...
...If you're going to get made fun of for where you shop, and it DOES bother you, well, that sucks but hey, it's not the government's job to make sure that doesn't happen. It happens in the real world to, what if the government just gave everybody uniforms for all the time? Then nobody could judge anybody! We should wear masks to, so the uglier people don't feel bad about it. Kurt Vonnecut wrote a short story about what the world would be like if everybody was made truly, truly, equal. I forget the name of the story, but it's worth finding and reading, it was only about 10 pages long.
Mrs. Pigpen
QUOTE(Adrian @ Apr 3 2003, 01:28 AM)
Well, if you have the sort of friends who will make fun of you for where you shop, they aren't friends... Wal-mart is cool, they have the greatest belts. Anybody asks, my choice of store is the Salvation Army or Unique Thrift and I really couldn't care less what they have to say about that...
...If you're going to get made fun of for where you shop, and it DOES bother you, well, that sucks but hey, it's not the government's job to make sure that doesn't happen. It happens in the real world to, what if the government just gave everybody uniforms for all the time? Then nobody could judge anybody! We should wear masks to, so the uglier people don't feel bad about it. Kurt Vonnecut wrote a short story about what the world would be like if everybody was made truly, truly, equal. I forget the name of the story, but it's worth finding and reading, it was only about 10 pages long.

Wow! You're right! I'll ditch those friends and find new ones! I'll also be sure to never work for the military, entertainment or recreation establishments, or transportation companies when I grow up because they'll make me wear a uniform too!
Adrian
For a libertarian, you sure don't speak like one. When you get a job, it is entirely different, as that is a volentarary thing you do for money. School is somewhere that you have to go, without a choice, until at least the age 16, and is government run. Public schools are wrong in the first place, but since we have them, they must be as free as any other government facility. It is not the government's decision what your or I wear at any time.
And, in all seriousness, WHY would anybody want a friend who gave any thought to where clothes are bought by somebody who is not themselves? These are the same people who go through High School thinking they're gods, and end up popping pills in the kitchen by 35, married to somebody they hate, with kids they don't take care of, and cheating at every chance they get. It would be ridiculus to say this happens to all of them, but it certainly does come from that materialistic personality that is that concerned about clothing that they will not be your friend or will humiliate you for what you wear.
I have plenty of friends. And (gasp!) none of them care how I dress and I respect how they dress.
Teenage years are cruel ones, people are greatly immature, but that's how life works. Personal Attack Removed You could never get me to wear a school uniform. The P.E. uniforms are bad enough! I would not do it, I'd let them throw whatever punishment at me that they want, but at a public school I will not dress how the government tells me to.
Platypus
I had to wear school uniforms for two years - all day and on weekends too, because it was a boarding school. I'm not exactly a conformist but I survived. The fact is, it really did eliminate clothing as one more thing to obsess about, or pick on people for. It didn't eliminate all teasing or bullying by any means, but it was still an improvement; of all the things that people use to determine status, clothes are one of the silliest. I'd rather see students distinguishing themselves by academic or athletic or other extracurricular performance - or even mere preference - than by what clothes they wear. The time and energy saved by precluding such meaningless competition is a positive thing too, not to mention easing the burden on parents' (or the students' own) wallets.
Adrian
Actually, that's fine... since you went to a private school...
...But when they do it at Public schools, it's just another step in that direction towards good old 1984.

I would also like to add that while I respect the mod's decision to remove my "personal attack" from my post, I feel the need to say that it was, in fact, not a personal attack. "You" is a generic term, and I am refering to anybody who may believe the view I was refering to. In other words, no personal attack was made. Was it a little out of line? Maybe. But I'm not familar with this board, and I'm use to comments like that not being considered as such. I'm going to type my words with extra caution then... lots of police around. shifty.gif whistling.gif
xgeographyx
Adrian, the story was Harrison Bergeron. smile.gif

As far as my opinion on the topic. If you are in middle school, junior high, high school, whatever, you are STILL A KID. I am not going to argue about the constitution and the implications of uniforms because really all it comes down to is that these are KIDS. Let them be kids while they still can. Of course you couldn't go to school in your underwear but when you grow up you have to conform to work attire.

Let them be comfortable and wear what they want while they still can! biggrin.gif
Adrian
Yes, that's right! Thanks, I should read that story again.
"Gee, that one must have been a doosey."
Was that the line? Something like that... yeah. Heh.

We might be "kids" but I don't remember age limits on the constitution. I'm not arguing with you, since I obviously agree with you, just adding to you point. biggrin.gif
xgeographyx
Well, I am only 19, so I am not trying to devalue you in any way by saying "kid" but as long as you are living at home and still a minor then let you act like it!

Also, I meant I wasn't going to bring the Constitution and the Great Implications of Uniforms ™ into it because I think when you just get down to it, they're just clothes. smile.gif
Platypus
QUOTE(Adrian @ Apr 2 2003, 11:32 PM)
Actually, that's fine... since you went to a private school...
...But when they do it at Public schools, it's just another step in that direction towards good old 1984.

A lot of your comments seem to indicate that you believe public schools are mandatory. They're not. If you don't like how the public schools teach, or how they enforce discipline, or that they require uniforms, you have a private-school option and a home-school option. If you do choose - and it is a choice to take advantage of public schools, though, you do it according to their conditions. It's not coercion when you can take your "business" elsewhere.
JonBon
QUOTE(quarkhead @ Mar 29 2003, 11:38 PM)
QUOTE(goamerica @ Mar 29 2003, 03:04 PM)
I'm against it because it is against Freedom of Expression

Are you also against work-based dress codes?

Yes, I am. I think that both school uniforms and the shirt-&-tie dress-code of work serve no purpose. All they do is pander to superficial appearance-based value judgements and denote that, as long as you wear that unform, your school or company owns you. These sort of dress-codes are little more than modern-day slave collars. What i wear makes no difference to who I am, what i can do or how I behave. Consequently, i fail to see why it should matter to anyone other than me.
Tmac960
QUOTE(nighttimer @ Mar 30 2003, 02:56 AM)
School should be about academics and education.  I could care less about the fashion aspect.

Totaly agree nighttimer
But it can go to far:
Public Schools around here don't have a strict dress code. Have your shirt tucked in white shoes. That's fine but a catholic school in the region took the dress code to far. Three times with your shirt untucked and you were SISPENDED. I'm not joking. Three times and you were suspended that's taking it way to far. The public schools in the region decided not to put this plan to affect. Just because it was to strict
Eeyore
In some situations appearances create a better reality. I believe that there are limits as to what you should be allowed to wear to school.

Dressing in decent clothes is a sign of respect and, yes to a degree, a sign of submission. Wearing torn clothing, beer advertisements, or clothing that is revealing are areas that school administrations should at least decide about.

I think a dress code sends a message that helps create a healthier learning environment. When some students head off to school in clothes that are cutting edge in terms of the rules or the "rules" of decency, this often can create a competition. In other cases, girls get in expensive fashion wars trying to keep up with the Janeses. I don't feel dress codes should be mandatory everywhere, but dress is an issue that needs to be considered by all school administrations.
Tmac960
I say that public schools have a dress code. Not a bad one. They should just have to tuck in their shirts, no rips in clothing, No bad words on clothing, and simple stuff. Not vary strict. just that a teacher will send you to call your parents to bring new clothing if in violation of the rules. Nothing major
Logalot
I'd like to point out that there are always loopholes. And really, in a school with 5000 kids, it would be easy as punch to avoid detection while breaking the dress code. Uniforms make things easier on everybody, the students and the teachers.
Eeyore
You still can untuck your shirt or hem your skirt too high with a uniform. If a school is going to set a dress code or use a uniform it has to be ready to enforce it for the long haul or it will undermine the authority of the school.
nileriver
i wait for a system like the movie logans run to come along, as i remeber school officails are nazis, but to smash youth spirt would be fun for them, prep the kids for military service even biggrin.gif

but i can see wheir it would be needed in some school systems and most social orders have some kind of a dress code anyways, like ninjas and cowboys ph34r.gif
ConservPat
QUOTE(quarkhead @ Mar 29 2003, 07:38 PM)
QUOTE(goamerica @ Mar 29 2003, 03:04 PM)
I'm against it because it is against Freedom of Expression

Are you also against work-based dress codes?

Most public schools also have dress codes anyway. There are things you can't wear to school. What about the kid who wore the "Bush in the crosshairs" Tshirt? A lot of schools ban suggestive clothing. Should we get rid of all those standards as well? Or is abrogating the freedom of expression ok in some ways, but not in others? Why can't I wear a thong to work? Why can't I go to school naked for that matter? It's freedom of expression.

I think that sometimes we get so caught up in the veneer of our freedoms that we lose sight of their roots. People will argue a point like this to death, and meanwhile ignore many of the more serious abrogations of liberty being enacted in the White House and in the Corporate board rooms. Remember the kid who was suspended for wearing a Pepsi shirt on the school Coca Cola picture day? Now that is a real problem in regards to fredom of expression. The school had signed a contract with Coca Cola. So a kid gets suspended for not displaying brand loyalty (everyone else was wearing Coca Cola shirts).

Blech.

I get where you're coming from but, you have to realize that kids have more of a need to express themselves more than most adults.

CP us.gif
acrimonious punker
As a public high school student who's forced to wear uniform shirts every day, I would have to say that I'm against them. I know mostly only of my personal experiance with them, but I'd have to say that's more than most of you are bringing to the table. Teachers and Administration gave a big speach to the DOE sometime last summer about the benifits of school uniforms; students can concentrate more on studies, there's no clicks between the students, and indentification for security reasons (still beating everything that they could out of the 9-11 tragedy). I haven't seen any of these benifits surface since the uniforms where installed at our school. My studies have stayed unchanged, kids still form social hierichies and I feel no safer when the real threat at schools is locally (kids killing kids). Not to mention that students can get waivers therefore voiding any reason for having uniforms. They just don't work at public schools and are a waste of the administarions energies when kids don't wear them and teachers don't enforce the rules.
Rattlesnake
Personally, I don't think I would have made it through school without my birkenstocks and Phish shirts. Clothes can say something about a person, and I really don't think that's something that should be taken away. Maybe in junior high, but not in high school.
Greenring7
I am against School Uniforms in Public Schools.

1. It is against free expresion.

This is inherently different than work or private school dress codes, as the government REQUIRES you to attend school. Similar to establishment of religion - you cannot have school (teacher/staff/rep. student) lead prayer, because it "establishes" a religion, as you are required by law to attend.

2. It is expensive.

What am I wearing today?

boxers = 3 for $7
Sandals, size 14 = $25
Grey skateboard pants+loop belt = $14.99
Hanes Blue T-shirt = $3.98
Red button down t-shirt = $5.98
total= $52.28 - $25 (as you only need one pair of sandals) = $27.

School uniforms (assuming you are not average enough to find it in the flea markets)
Boxers = 3 for $7
Shoes = $60++ (one time purchase)
Pants = $30++
Belt = $15++ (one time purchase)
tshirt = $3.98
Uniform shirt (usually white button down, pressed) = $10++
Uniform Jacket (one time purchase)= $60++
total=$182 - (one time purchases)= $46.28
---

Almost double the daily cost.

-Robert
Bill55AZ
I am against uniforms, but for a stricter dress code. School is supposed to be a place of education. They can show off their boxers/baggy pants/emerging sexuality/etc. after school.
Children in the wonder years (you wonder why you had the little hellions) are searching for their identity and will hop from one group to another til they find the one where they feel the most accepted. Each group has to set itself apart from the others and how they dress is part of that process.
As parents, we should explain this to them, and stress that it is not rquired that they follow one of the crowds, that they can be true individuals rather than a copy of someone else.
But having said that, it is only a stage that they go through. Once they hit the real world of jobs and work and the cruelty of having to support themselves, they WILL dress like someone else tells them. biggrin.gif
Platypus
QUOTE(Greenring7 @ Jun 17 2003, 10:30 AM)
2. It is expensive.

What am I wearing today?

How many sets of skateboard pants and shirts do you have, that you wear to school? How many uniforms would you need? I went to a school with uniforms once; they only required two sets of clothes for winter and two for summer. Add in one set of clothes for once-a-term "mufti day" and that's five sets of clothes total for all you wear anywhere except the athletic field. Now, I don't know what the current fashions are in your high school, but I think even poor students have more than five shirts and pairs of pants and shoes, etc. Comparing costs without accounting for usage isn't an honest comparison.
Greenring7
Holy crap?

If you only had two uniforms, did you wash your clothes ever other night? Or did you just wear dirty clothes?

I'm at university right now. I have 3 shorts, 6 pants, 7 shirts, and 2 button downs. Oh, and a pair of sandals and a pair of sneakers.

Of course, no one would notice if you only had 3 pants. But yea, you do need shirts.

I guess you have a point there, with uniforms, you can wear the same set of clothes every day.

But I hope you wash 'em. And change boxers and socks.

d'oh. I also have 7 boxers.

-Robert
Jaime
QUOTE(Greenring7 @ Jun 17 2003, 02:01 PM)
Holy crap?

If you only had two uniforms, did you wash your clothes ever other night? Or did you just wear dirty clothes?

Platypus asked you to make an honest comparison. Even if you don't feel like doing that, you still needn't be rude in your response to him. sad.gif
Platypus
QUOTE(Greenring7 @ Jun 17 2003, 02:01 PM)
If you only had two uniforms, did you wash your clothes ever other night? Or did you just wear dirty clothes?

Socks and underwear (I think we had three sets of those, actually) were tossed in the hamper every night. Shirts and shorts twice a week, jerseys once a week, IIRC, plus extra times if you got grass stains on them or something. Of course, this was a boarding school and our collective laundry was done every single night, so you could literally wear the same clothes every day if you wanted to (e.g. if one pair of pants got lost, stolen or damaged) and they'd always be clean. Things would have to work a little differently in a day-school environment, obviously.

The point, though, is that use patterns for uniforms are still likely to be quite different from those for "civilian" clothes. There are other aspects of your comparison that I also find misleading, as well. For example, you say you're wearing $25 sandals. Well and good for you, but that's not what I see most kids wearing on their feet. I also suspect that gender, socioeconomic status, and fashion play roles too. Not everyone goes for the grunge look. I still believe that uniforms would actually be cheaper than what most students wear, even if you personally serve as a counterexample.
Billy Jean
I am totally against school uniforms. I went to a private school and there was no sense of idividuality, I was very jealous of public school kids. Being a girl now a days and being forced to wear a kilt everyday is awful! Sitting at a desk, lunch, breaks, recess! It's very restrictive and makes you feel vulnerable.
mad.gif
Greenring7
Yo dude, I'm totally not trying to be a smart um... ok.. if I can't say the original word for donkey here, what can I say if I'm not trying to be a smart.. uh.. help?

Honestly, the way I was raised, you do the laundry once every two weeks. I do it once a week because I only brought a weeks worth of clothes up here.

But in the sense you state, in a boarding school, where they do your laundry for you every night, that's cool, and uniforms are acceptable in private boarding schools (never heard of a public boarding school).

But, this thread is about Public Schools. In public school, each person goes home and is responsible for showing up clean the next day. Given what you have outlined, it seems that either the parents will have to make a much larger initial expenditature (almost twice as much) for uniforms (to buy an amount equal to that of normal clothes) -or- do the laundry anywhere from 2 to 4 times as much as normal (but only buying the very limited amount you outlined).

-Robert
Rumblestrip
A sense of discipline is exactly what is lacking in schools today. Kids are running wild and doing anything and everything except learning. Learn some respect and decency in school and it will work its way into the rest of your life too. This whole attitude of anything goes, if it feels good, do it, has already proven to be destructive and will only get worse unless we change direction soon.
Jaime
QUOTE(Rumblestrip @ Jun 23 2003, 08:01 AM)
A sense of discipline is exactly what is lacking in schools today. Kids are running wild and doing anything and everything except learning. Learn some respect and decency in school and it will work its way into the rest of your life too. This whole attitude of anything goes, if it feels good, do it, has already proven to be destructive and will only get worse unless we change direction soon.

And what does any of this have to do with the topic we are debating - SCHOOL UNIFORMS? Please stay on topic.
Rumblestrip
It is on topic. Having a uniform/dress code would be a good start to a policy that would do the schools and the students a lot of good. There is plenty of time for expression and play outside of school. A lot of kids today need to learn the difference.
moif
I had to wear a uniform in school. I attended a state school in England and it was no big deal to wear a uniform.

If I had to decide though, I'd say scrap the unifroms. Let the kids be kids. They'll have to conform to social conventions as adults so why burden them with it as children.
ohmyheck
QUOTE(Mrs. Pigpen @ Mar 29 2003, 06:52 PM)
I think that student uniforms are a great idea, personally.
It is a LOT cheaper for the parents, and eliminates the economic appearance disparity (I can't think of a better phraseology).

LOVING IT. I was fortunate in my experience went to two public schools and a private school with uniforms, went to Utah school with no uniforms. Guess where I hated most ? Yeah, u know it. Anyway, for those who think it's a violation of freedom of expression. I have always wanted to go everywhere naked as my right but can I? Dress codes so fruitless, have u ever seen someone who enforces dress codes? Has any parent really been scolded for their children's incompliance with the school dress codes? Whatever the case it's minimizes so much of the crap that goes on in high school these days. Girls with so much make up trying to be older and then when they are older they have plastic surgery to look younger. What a bunch of bull, why not enjoy your childhood and experience all kinds of people in high school regardless of their economic status, race, gender and what not. Everyone is unique, lets embrace it at the same time it doesn't have to mean communism, just more variations.
R3DWhIt3BlU3
QUOTE(goamerica @ Mar 29 2003, 11:04 PM)
I'm against it because it is against Freedom of Expression


[FONT=Courier][SIZE=1][COLOR=green]I've notice how many of "updaters" say that they're against because it is violating the freedom of expression. Well, even though "they" have the freedom of expression, they may express it inappropriately. Like once there was this girl who wore this tight mini skirt that was really short.
You know what happens next? SHE LOST HER VIRGINITY excl.gif

true story

I think its okay for elementary school to not have uniforms, but middle and high school should have uniforms.
Cyan
QUOTE
I've notice how many of "updaters" say that they're against because it is violating the freedom of expression.


What do you mean by "updaters?" unsure.gif

QUOTE
Well, even though "they" have the freedom of expression, they may express it inappropriately. Like once there was this girl who wore this tight mini skirt that was really short. You know what happens next? SHE LOST HER VIRGINITY


She lost her virginity to a mini-skirt? That's impressive. innocent.gif

Do you think perhaps that could have happened regardless of what she was wearing?
EarlessBunny
I am against uniforms. I go to a public high school with all different types of people who dress all different ways, and no one is distracted by the clothing, and no one gets hung up on whether someone else is wearing the "latest fashions." Even if one student tried to pick on another for their outfit, it probably wouldn't matter, because the student being teased would more than likely not care. Now, this may not be the situation in every public school, but not everything is fun and fancy free in the real world. People aren't always nice. Adults do judge by clothing and appearance. So sheltering kids from that doesn't really do much good.

QUOTE
A sense of discipline is exactly what is lacking in schools today. Kids are running wild and doing anything and everything except learning. Learn some respect and decency in school and it will work its way into the rest of your life too.


Sometimes the schools focus so much on kids being within dress code, that it takes away from the learning process a bit. Kids should dress appropriately for school, but they're not in prision. They should be allowed to wear basically whatever they want (within reason).
TennesseeLeftWinger
I hold with the "it's against the kids' freedom of expression" viewpoint myself. There are some who claim that clothes are not a means of expression, and for those kids who think it is, they should just find another way to express themselves. I personally disagree with that. There are many people at my school who express themselves by their clothing and the message it purveys (e.g. some kids wear clothing made by companies that do not manufacture their clothing in third-world sweatshops, and some, like me, prefer to wear our political viewpoints on our shirts). To have some adult come and tell them that they "don't really express themselves that way" is absolutely asinine. Students have numerous ways of expressing themselves, and clothing is one that many choose. To take that away from them is to limit their ability to express themselves. I personally feel that if the clothing is not so utterly vulgar or promiscuous that it disturbs the learning environment, students should be allowed to wear the clothing of their choice. And besides, unless the child intends to be in the military until he/she retires, that student is going to be faced with the real-world challenge of picking out appropriate clothing! ohmy.gif Let's not shelter our kids from that task, and let's not rob them of their right to express themselves.
Paladin Elspeth
I think freedom of expression is fine, unless your parents don't have the wherewithal to clothe you as well or as trendily as your peers. When I was in school, I saw other kids being taunted mercilessly if their clothes were out of style or looked like the hand-me-downs they probably were.
Uniforms, for the most part, de-emphasize class and economic distinctions.
The personality of the child and that child's performance in school become the focus, and nothing is more individual than personality.
After school, the child may wear what s/he wants or can afford to wear. But in school, uniforms represent an effort to remove distractions and minimize classism.

So I am for school uniforms.
Mrs. Pigpen
QUOTE(TennesseeLeftWinger @ Jul 25 2003, 10:55 PM)
And besides, unless the child intends to be in the military until he/she retires, that student is going to be faced with the real-world challenge of picking out appropriate clothing! ohmy.gif  Let's not shelter our kids from that task, and let's not rob them of their right to express themselves.

Don't forget workers in food service, medical staff, postal service, law enforcement, firefighters, the entertainment industry, hospitality fields, and sanitation all require uniforms as well.
Juber3
QUOTE(moif @ Jun 23 2003, 08:49 AM)
I had to wear a uniform in school. I attended a state school in England and it was no big deal to wear a uniform.

If I had to decide though, I'd say scrap the unifroms. Let the kids be kids. They'll have to conform to social conventions as adults so why burden them with it as children.

smile.gif I disagree with dress code. You cant express your self on such a level that you can without it. However i do think their should be limits to dressing the way you do.
debatequeen5320
I've always been against school uniforms. I really think that it is another way of taking away our freedom. Let's let the kids decide who they want to be and what they want to wear *within reason!!!*...instead of letting someone else decide for them.
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