Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: The Pledge of Allegiance
America's Debate > Archive > Social Issues Archive > [A] Education
Pages: 1, 2, 3
Google
Billy Jean
I'm sorry, but what is wrong with national pride? We needed teach our children at an early age about the Constitution, the Bill of Rights, Emancipation Proclamation and the Pledge of Allegiance. It's the foundation of our nation and they have a right to know our history, They're Americans. I see nothing wrong with a little indoctrination of National pride and tradition. But like I said, if they don't want to say UNDER GOD, they shouldn't be forced or scolded for it.

Edited to add: Some of these preschoolers are going to grow up and be soldiers and die for this nation, and I take comfort in the fact that they know why their laying their lives down. Some people find peace in the fact that tradition, culture and history is preserved and faith instilled through pledges and oaths. Without those vows nations loose cohesiveness and deteriorate. There has to be something to bind us together... us.gif
Google
Christopher
I rarely bothered with the pledge of Allegiance in high school. Probably only said it a handful of times. Happen to beleive I am a good American. My brother is the same. He was a Marine.
If you have to brainwash kids to beleive in their country than is your country worth it? I am firm in my love for this country and it is based on her principles. No matter how badly some in this country abuse what it means to be an American I always stand strong for my home.
Think of all the ways people invent to make it here and become citizens. Many die trying thanks to disgusting immigrationpolicies, but STILL they come.
Lead by example not mantras.

edited to add
It is the ideals of America I owe my loyalty to. Adopted to my personal philosophies on life because I found them to be good. People should have more faith in our country and stop listening to those who have so little confidence in America that they live in fear that at any moment She will fall.
Billy Jean
I agree. I'm not saying that NOT saying the pledge in it's current state means your unpatriotic. Not at all. You can say it how ever you want. I'm a firm believer in that Actions speak louder than words. And I admire those that come to this country legally under some of the most horrendous circumstances. I also find it ironic that they seem less concerned with the pledge than those naturally born here. Maybe it's because they understand that there's worse things in this world to complain about.... hmmm.gif
nebraska29
QUOTE(surreality @ Jan 10 2004, 09:45 PM)
What do you propose to get them to understand exactly what they're saying?

Yes!!!, that would be a great thing! They should learn to say it when they are old to cognitively understand what the pledge means. To require kids to state it when they are too young to tell an adult when it means upon being asked, is to really just engage in an exercise of futility.

I have a problem with the fact that very few people in here have picked up on the fact that the man who composed the pledge, quit attending church because his congregation supported slavery. The mans original intent(something conservatives like in the constitution, but ignore in this case) should be honored and the pledge should be restored to it's 1950s, pre-McCarthy era phrasing.
labacia
QUOTE(Conservpat @ Jan 9 2004, 10:24 PM)
QUOTE
So the point is that there's NO POINT in saying it in the first place. It's there, it doesn't improve the way people feel about the country, so what's the point? It serves no purpose. You say, "if it means nothing to students, then so be it." If it means nothing, then really, why say it at all?
Because it means something to some...Some know what the Pledge represents...some respect what the Pledge represents so much so that even if they don't actually care to say it all the time they understand why it is said. America has given a lot of opportunities to people in schools, giving America oh, what, a few sentences that take up minimal time every day is not unreasonable at all.

CP us.gif

It is extremely unreasonable - It's an all-out lie. Sure, it doesn't take much time, but you fail to take into consideration the beliefs of others, and the strength of those beliefs. It's like justifying legislation to enforce children to say "The sky is orange and so are you, supreme lord of the shrimp-men. We are forever in your tentacle-covered service." because it doesn't take much time. But the problem with forcing this pledge of allegiance to the shrimp-god is that not everyone believes in the power of the shrimp-god, and some people would believe quite strongly in opposing things, such as the fork-god and the like.

My point is, unless you want to completely ingore the pleas of indignation of others, punishing people for not promising you that they will serve the country (or currently residing "leader") is a completely abhorrent and disgusting practice.

If you moved to France, or Germany, and your kid told you that they were forcing him to pledge to faithfully live and die for France, or Germany for the rest of his life, and that if he didn't, he was sent home, would you just shrug and tell him that no one cares about what he believes?
Google
This is a simplified version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Invision Power Board © 2001-2008 Invision Power Services, Inc.