Over the ongoing debate over homosexuality that we've had, I posted about the over sexualized straight male. Our culture is very sexually liberated in the media. Does the board think this is healthy or appropriate?

Are men over sexed or are women undersexed? I would argue thousands of years of patriarchial religions which severely repressed female sexuality outside of marriage has left women still sexually repressed.

Nobody is directly harmed by healthy (ie. non-destructive practices such as auto-erotic asphyxiation) sexuality. Harm is incurred when people are merely jarred from rigidly introduced understandings of sexuality. I think as a society we are neither over or undersexed; we merely handle it poorly.

I think America is still too prudish about sexuality. I would much rather have my children be exposed to sexuality than violence. I think open and frank sexuality leads to a healthier life. I also believe that children can be exposed to sexuality and not become sex-crazed addicts as soon as they hit puberty.

Sexuality, believe it or not, is a good tool to learning about life.

Creation of life, to be more specific.

I have to agree Eeyore that being exposed to sex is better than violence because violence is too graphic for a person to be seeing

I think Americans are oversexed. Sex is everywhere, to the point it’s really hard for me to believe anyone would think otherwise. What would have to happen for Americans to be ‘unprudish’ in your view, Eeyore? We have sex channels, all media seems preoccupied with it, type in the word ‘pregnant’ on yahoo and get 100,000 sites of pornography… in the list is endless. Sexual imagery is literally in your face all of the time. We have sex shops, illegal but abundant sex workers, high-speed internet porn. How on earth are we repressed?

I don’t believe in exposing my children to violence, either. Fortunately, it isn’t necessary for me to expose my children to either sex or violence until I feel they are ready. If you disagree, ask yourself the question...are children more likely to be involved in a shooting, or catch a venereal disease and/ or have an unplanned pregnancy? Look at the list of the primary reasons why teens are having sex, as well as the consequences: http://www.w-cpc.org/sexuality/teens.html
You’ll notice that the word ‘misinformed’ is not one of the reasons. I have seen many the parent, very eager to teach their child the correct names for body parts (because they erroneously thought that was imperative to a healthy sexual image) have it backfire on them. The pizza boy comes to the house, ”Where’s your scrotum?” inquires the three year old. Young girls at a ballet (loudly) , “I can almost see his penis, those pants are so tight!” Children should know about sex and violence when they understand the concept of discipline, impulse control, and consequences. Period.

Now, there is a vast, vast difference between having a healthy view of the human body and being sexually aware. They are not synonymous. Nudity is natural for everyone (under the right circumstance), sex is for adults. Which brings me to the next point….

I think there’s a very unhealthy aspect to sexuality here. How can anyone have a healthy body image when they’re constantly inundated with a world of beautiful figures, technologically enhanced and flaws eliminated? Breasts are unnaturally pushed into ridiculously small tops and lifted, squashed, padded, inflated. Pam Anderson, with her plastic assets, would have never made her millions (based on no talent whatsoever) in almost any other country in the world (IMO). You don’t often see that kind of hardware on a European beach. It's all connected...unhealthy body image, preoccupation with sexual imagery, subsequent problems with real, intimate sex.

I have to agree with mspigpen that the sexual imagery everywhere is a detriment to society. It sems that entertainment has been ruined by sexual imagery. I don't know if Patsy Cline or Mahalia Jackson could make it as singers today. The latest reality shows make me want to puke, and all I see are the promos.

I think the key phrase is "Our culture is very sexually liberated in the media" (my italics)

The problems arise because there is a different degree of sexual liberation in the media than in 'the real world'.

Those who aspire to the levels of sexuality they see in the media find that they come across other problems - disease, emotional complications, or simply not being able to "get it" as much or with people as good-looking as the people they see as role models.

And there are many others who think that we should not aspire to the levels of sexuality we see in the media, and that the media should not portray so much stuff of sexual nature.

What I find interesting is the different attitude to these issues in different countries. The USA seems to place a great deal more emphasis on limiting access to sex in the mainstream media - while at the same time it has phenomenally huge production of and appetites for pornography. It is a federal offence to swear on network television at any time of day or night there. And most of your TV drama output involves murder and violence, usually gun-related, in one way or another, without drawing the same levels of controversy. (That's not to say anything about it's quality, which is often very high.)

This contrasts with the UK, where mainstream TV has been happy for limited use of male and female nudity and depictions of simulated sex after a 9.00pm "watershed". You can also say the "F" word on mainstream network TV here, and even the (GASP) "C" word, within certain guidelines. They still attract their share of complaints, and our TV dramas involve almost as many murder mysteries and police procedurals. We now even have the right to see "hardcore" pornography in the same ways you do - on cable & satellite, VHS and DVD, and in print, but not on network TV. But the attitude to violence here is somewhat less liberal. These days most American TV or movie imports are edited to remove the most violent scenes, if they are edited for anything. We don't see clumsy dubbing of "muddyfunster" nealry as often as I suspect you do.

The British are still uptight about sex and sexuality, compared to the French or Italians (that have nudity in some of their family gameshows!), and of course the Germans (who ust take it all very seriously ) yet we do seem relatively more relaxed than Americans.

You don’t often see that kind of hardware on a European beach.
True, but you are more likely to see unfettered, naked, but non-augmented breasts, or even full nudity, on public beaches in Europe than in the USA. Plastic surgery is catching on quickly in Europe, but perhaps the need for such superstimulation is less intense, because you can see pretty much anything anatomical you want to see.

I think this goes towards your idea of what might constitute a healthy attitude to sex and sexuality - if it were less channelled into innuendo and ghettoised into porn, perhaps Americans could stop worrying about it so much. In other words, perhaps the American media needs to be MORE sexualised, not less, but in more direct ways.

I'm not trying to bash America here, as many of the problems you refer to are equally prominent here. For instance we just got some scary figures for the increasing rates of sexually transmitted diseases, and we have some of the highest teen pregnancy rates anywhere (after you guys, that is).

In Sociology class, we watched a documentry about how a advertising specialist analyzed today's ads in America's company advertisings.

She showed examples that companies use sexual images as an attention getter for their advertisments when sex wouldn't have anything to do with the product.

For example, there is a drink i believe that is called Dintein Ice (or something like that) and they have a sweating guy on fire escape stairs, he sees this cute girl, he drinks the cold drink, he cools off & they make out. Sex would have nothing to do with this drink.

Dentine Ice is gum, and while it doesn't have anything to do with sex, it could easily have something to do with kissing.

I know what you are saying, though. The idea of advertising is to get someone to associate a product with positive effects. If a company can make someone think that drinking X brand soda will help them get chicks, then it is probably a good advertising campaign.

I tend to agree with Julian when he said:

Now, I must ask the question...How would you do that, exactly?

I agree with Julian. There is a great deal of difference between "liberated sexuality" and sexploitation in the media.

Being subjected constantly to eroticized images, blatant or subliminal, on advertisements is not liberation.

I also agree with mrs.pigpen that it is not healthy to constantly compare oneself to the airbrushed images of male and female that are intended to sell a product.

A healthy sexuality is not contingent upon buying the right product in order to "get some." It is a state of being that accepts oneself to the extent that shyness and self-criticism do not get in the way of self actualization and becoming closer to someone you care about.

We don't need more talk about sex on the airwaves. We need the talk to be of a better quality to develop workable attitudes on the way men and women are and how we relate to each other on an intimate level.

Heh. That's a question that I'm not sure that I can answer.

I think that taking the "naughty" aspect out of sex is the key, but I have no idea how you take the taboo away when it's so deeply ingrained.

Billy Jean mentioned the "oversexualized straight male," and in another thread, she talked about straight men and pornography. Why do so many men watch porn? Why don't more women? Why aren't women more sexually adventurous? Would they be more adventurous if society didn't give conflicting messages about womens' sexuality? If a woman has a sexual drive that equals her male counterpart is she liberated or is she a whore?

I think that depicting strong women in sexual situations in the media is positive. I also think that depicting men in emotional, intimate situations is positive. Reducing the sexuality gap in the media, if you will.

Edited to fix my quotes.

Yes, American society has made great strides in the realm of sexuality, however, I believe that the fundamental Puritan values of this country's first settlers are still evident in our culture. Quite frankly, I believe that our society is not sexual enough. I mean, there are still groups out there that preach on the "immorality" of masturbation. Sexual education in the classroom remains to be an inappropriate and controversial subject, and I am sure that little boys and girls are still separated into two groups to discuss their parts "down there." It's ridiculous. Sex is a good thing, and it is a natural and beautiful thing. We should not be ashamed or embarrassed by it. There are so many sexually related things that are STILL considered to be taboo, and "off limits." I don't know. Some reports that I see in the media, I sometimes feel as though this country is moving backwards on the issues of human sexuality. Maybe I should just move to Europe. Now, I am not saying that everyone should go out and jump into bed with anything and everything that moves. I AM saying that the Puritan mentality should relax a little. As Americans, we have the freedom to express ourselves. Why shouldn't this apply to expressing ourselves sexually?

It is a difficult dilemma. When I hear the suggestion that we need to become more sexualized, in more direct ways, I can't help mentally equating that with something along the lines of saying, "Americans are extremely fat. What we need is more food". In one sense, it's true. We are fat because the food we eat is junky. We have a warped sexual concept because we are exposed to unrealistic and abundant depictions of sex. On the other hand, more food isn't necessarily the answer...Unless you forego all the junk food entirely and only eat the healthy stuff. More sexual stimulus won't necessarily do anything but aggravate the problem, unless the imagery is real and unpolluted....Something that I don't see happening here.

I enjoyed beaching in Europe. I often went 'native', and my kids ran around naked with the other kids. It wasn't a sexually charged environment, it was simply enjoying freedom and relaxation on the beach. There doesn't seem to be the same correlation between sex and nudity there. That's a completely foreign concept here in the US. I still can't seem to keep my older child in clothing. He is accustomed to running around naked in the yard, which was standard for children during the summer in Italy.

True, Italian television depicts nudity, and a lot of sexual imagery, but most Italians don't vegetate in front of the television much at all. It certainly doesn't teach them everything they know about relationships, which is about the point we're at here. To give you an example of how different the mentality is...When my (Italian) cousin graduated, her college had a tradition of stripping graduates down to their undergarments (in the middle of the afternoon) and chasing them into the town fountain. She was very excited about it, and bought a beautiful bra and panty set for the occasion. Can you imagine that happening here? On the other hand, she wasn't allowed to date until she was 19, and she never had underaged sex. Simply a different society with a much better body (and overall sexual) concept, and few of the problems which I believe are a result of our sexual confusion.

If you believe in free speech, those groups have the right to express their opinion just as you do.

I had sex ed 17 years ago, and they didn't separate the sexes then. I am surprised to hear that they do now. I actually don't believe that they do.
Is someone stopping you?

Perhaps I am not clear on what I mean. I don't necessarily associate the word sexuality with sex, if that makes sense. Sexuality to me is any expression of love, of the human body, of the soul. Admittedly, I have never been to Europe, though I wish with all of my heart that I could go some day, but it must be said that I was being a bit facetious, hence this smiley: Yes, I realize that these groups are allowed to express their opinions, just as the KKK is, but I mentioned this as a way of making a point. Yes, girls and boys are separated where I grew Up and went to school, and every person I have ever had the sex ed debate with was no different. Where did you go to school? As far as your statement about television not teaching about relationships, I would certainly hope that it wouldn't. You learn such from experience. You prove my point well: if we were a more sexually liberated society, nudity, etc. would not be held in such regard as it is now. It wouldn't be a big deal, just as the graduation tradition was not, rather it was fun, and nothing exceptionally spectacular. I am sure the boys did not stand and point and become mindless drones capable of grunting only the word "boobs." If we were more open with our sexuality and sensuality, we would not deem it as something so extraordinary. Perhaps then, a gyrating, scantily-clad female pop star would not cause such an uproar. In other words, as you discuss, maybe the correlation between sex and nudity would not be so dramatic. As far as expressing myslef sexually, not one person is stopping me, but as I am sure you have read in the news, the Supreme Court has JUST overturned the anti-sodomy law in Texas. So, it is quite possible to face repercussions for sexual expression in this country.

We're oversexed and underconnected. Sure, there are depictions everywhere of sex, but it's sex as escapism or as forbidden fruit or as symbol of rebellion - against whom, I have no idea and neither do the people who continue to push such imagery. It's not connected to love, and it's not connected to normal people; it's all out of context. Culturally, we're like the adolescents of an earlier age always talking about and thinking about and imagining sex, but not really having very much (or very good). We'd be better off if we were more like grownups who have plenty of sex - within marriage or similarly committed relationships, of course - and can then get on with life. There's something desperate, frustrated, and just plain immature about American attitudes toward sex.

Y'know... I'm not convinced that our "unhealthy" attitude towards sex is such a bad thing. To paraphrase John Waters, repression makes sex dirty, therefore more fun.
I just think that what is always proposed as a "healthy" attitude towards sex is just depressingly clinical, reducing one of the most important things in life to a mere physical act.

Sex is a simple physical act though.

Ironically enough, by trying to keep kids from learning about sex, parents are ultimately dressing up sex as something grand and picturesque.

Maybe I'm just one of those crazy radicals who thinks that, if sex wasn't so tied down and everyone was engaging in it, it wouldn't be such a big deal. As long as people safely practice sex, no one can really get harmed. Thus, I am in favor of a more open view of sex in the real world.

And note that I said in the real world. TV is where children get all their information about sex Adults don't want to talk about it, and children have, what, 3 classes about sex total in their lives. All of those classes teaches no- premarital sex and that abistenance should always be practiced (our school had some type of "second virginity", give me a break). The issue is hushed up otherwise, and so children turn on the Television and, wow, people are freely engaging in all kinds of stuff! No condoms, no protection, nothing.

My general philosophy is that you cannot protect children from themselves. If they want to have sex or want to find out about it, THEY WILL. Thus, having an open society, that isn't afraid of sex, will benefit from having awareness among children.

Edited: To fix a confusing sentence

Having been a fairly hedonistic person in my twenties and early thirties, then counseling poeple on this very topic- I have to say Americans seem to have an unrealistic picture of our society and sex. WE ALL WANT MORE, BUT WE DON'T GET SO MUCH OF IT AS WE WOULD LIKE seems to be the shouted from the rooftops mentality to me. A couples and sex pamphlet at work quotes a bunch of studies, that basically shows the average person in America having 7 sexual partners in thier life, total, and the married poeple have more sex then anyone, yet they still complain about it the most LOL

The average couple with children, 2 times a week is considered healthy and realistic. Prior to kids it is not out of average to have sex 6 times a week or more. All the couples with kids wished they could have more, for the most part (there were some other variables like health and drive of course) So it is about time, not willpower!

We wish we could have more time for sex, so we do the next best thing, and absorb it in the media. Men want the T&A shows and women want the Lifetime network. There is equal porn for chicks as dudes, we just don't recongnize it with women because it is not so blantant, just like most women LOL

When I was a "player" you had to have some style and panache. I notice today women are more like men, and are very aggressive, without as much style unfortunately. I was performing stand up comedy until about 4 years ago and I have noticed the change in the clubs remarkably. It used to be a flirtation from the stage, a pretty girl at the bar making suggestive eyes or leg crossings. Now as soon as you walk off stage, she whispers very in very graphic talk what her and her friend want to do to you. I enjoyed this when I was single, but now as I look back, I don't think it helps a person develope much style anymore LOL

I think we are sexual human beings that are repressed by our lack of time to devote to it and our puritan heritage. To make it a tad more valuable of an experiance but very healthy as good clean fun like the Europeans will be a good thing.