Wertz,
I can't tell what this has to do with the incredible greatness of America. What I can tell is that it sounds a little spiteful. More than anything else though you are treading very dangerous waters with this serious yet unsubstantiated accusation. Do you have any proof that Israel dictates US policy? You of all people Wertz should know not to post things like that here without SERIOUS documentation.

Hey everybody, haven't been on in a while [been on vacation]. Sounds to me like everyone wants to pluck apart every little thing America has done wrong. I believe that America's intent in "starting wars" was good [except for the war against Mexico]. So let's look at the intent of our country over the years, it's been pretty good. Doesn't seem like the US is so horrible. One selfish war, that's it, compare that to other countries and it looks pretty good.

CP

Which is the same impression they get when we give weapons and money to conflicts that we should be staying out of.

Liberia is much different from Iraq because we don't plan on going in and taking over afterwards. Plus we were asked to help and there are many other differences that makes comparison apples and oranges.

It's also different from Kosovo because we are not taking over their country or trying to profit from them or force our way of life on them or doing it all on our own. (as far as I know which if that is not the case please enlighten me.)

So, who are these people that aren't happy with the US no matter what it does? I think you would be correct to say they don't agree with certain administrations no matter what they do. Which makes sense since, in this country, we seem to have two separate and distinct set's of goals and priorities. One set just seems to be a little more in tune with the rest of the world than the other does.

I Agree. The US has always been way ahead of every other country in the rest of the world. With exception to slavery we have been the cutting edge country since conception taking risks that everybody else would have died before taking. We didn't get that way by listening to other countries about what America should be doing. And that's not how it's going to be if we want to continue on this path. And American Socialism isn't going to take us down that path either.

The way I see it, America's setting sort of a double standard by constantly going into other countries. On the one hand, we're always giving them money and aid in the times of great natural disasters and whatnot. On the other hand, we also go into other countries to police them, and to try and help out the people. What if those people dont want our help? What if they don't want the US government "americanizing" the world? We have to monitor our actions, folks, otherwise we can get in some really bad situations.

In the past, they had us defending them. I think it was since the 6 day war which they were almost overrun by arab neighbors. We jumped in and gave them the help they needed to win and prevent being strangled by the arab nations with the help of the soviets

What GOOD Reason Does Anyone Have For Disliking America, And Her People?

Johnlocke, there is no easy way to answer this question as it is subjective. What you may consider a good reason, I may not and vice versa. Some will cite our foreign policies; others (especially in the Muslim world) may cite what they consider to be our immorality, decadence, and wastefulness.

I believe it an exaggeration that majorities of people in foreign countries dislike the US. Sure, I know someone can provide polls that say otherwise but we all know that polls are not reliable and in many cases are designed to achieve a certain outcome. There are fringe elements in every country that dislike the US and always will. No change in our foreign/domestic/social policies will ever change their attitudes. That's not to say we shouldn't try. Perhaps the US needs to sell herself a little better.

In The Face Of The Billions Of Dollars We Give To The Whole World Over, What Can Anyone TRULY Say About The Supposedly Arrogant And Non-Compassionate Average American? :

The US agreed to donate 0.7% of our gross national product to foreign aid and we haven’t met that goal. Other nations haven’t either but we aren’t talking about other nations, are we? The US is, as always, held to a different standard.

Even of the 0.1% we do donate, two countries get the majority – one of them being Israel – and therein lies the problem. (Disclaimer: I do not consider our investment in Israel a problem, I support it fully.)

The average American is taxed and part of that tax goes to foreign aid. Then the average American reaches in his/her pocket and gives at least three times more to charity. This charity is all monetary - it doesn’t include an asset many people consider more valuable – time. US citizens ARE compassionate and thank goodness we are ABLE to donate.

If Americans Are So Intolerant, How Do We Get Along Over Here With All These Different Cultures and Races?

Intolerant? Please don’t talk to me about the U.S being intolerant. As Bill Maher said (paraphrasing here) "When all women are required to wear the veil here in the US, then you can talk to me about intolerance. When homosexuals and adulterers are stoned on Fridays here in the US, then we can talk about intolerance."

How Well Does Any Other Country Stand Up Against The Charges Leveled At Americans If The Questions Were Turned Around?

They don’t. They aren’t held to the same standards. The bar is always lowered for other countries, even our closest alias (with the exception of Israel).

And Finally, How Would Any Foreign Country Feel If The United States Took Away The Funding We Give It Due To Their Own Ungrateful Sentiments?

We shouldn’t take it away just because they are ungrateful. We should however, continue to use aid as a tool. You want a service, you pay for it. You want money to aid with the humanitarian cause of the day - fine – crack down on these radical Islamist – stop trafficking cocaine and opium, etc.

My tax dollars don't equate to a free ride.

All that means is that you are comparing yourself to some one else's conscience....

You mean a mandated conscience? A mandated morality? A religiously fanatical, government mandated conscience?

Yes I am comparing the US to that.

That veil is symbolic - it represents religious power over the government and is NOT a symbol of tolerance.

FYI, not all Muslim woman wear the veil. In westernized countries it isn't required. Not all Muslim women in countries that require the veil want to wear it - they have no choice. If they don't, they will be jailed, flogged or killed.

Moif,
EXACTLY!!! I wish for America to continue carrying on a tradition of doing what is right for America and for Americans without concerning ourselves with the European or Middle Eastern or Asian opinion. Now some people are probably going to say that what some think is right for America is wrong for America or perhaps maladaptive because it will create more terrorists or challenge other countries to oppose us in policy and at he UN. But thus far America has been able to carry out all of her goals and manage to maintain the important relationships with real friends and bypass people like the french government that prove they are more like a barking chauaua than a country of any real power. Thus far America has exacted her goals and come out on top.

Right. The point of a democracy is to decide what you want to do on your own and not by someone else's rules

There is a liberal faction that would have us subjugate our country's interests to that of the global community. They take offense at even the slightest show of nationalism. Thankfully they're in the minority. Hopefully they'll remain there.

The people in America who worry me the most are not the ones who worry that we're on the wrong side of a issue. It's the ones who think once America chooses a side of a issue it is always right.

If we're to be suspicious of the motives of those whom constantly see the worst of America, why should we then trust those who see no faults at all?

I love America more than any other country in this world, and, exactly for this reason, I insist on the right to criticize her perpetually.
--- James A. Baldwin

JohnLocke Jul 13 2003

I agree you give bigger than most but I do have to dissagree about your ACTUAL generosity.
I suggest you have a quick look at this from Caltech and adjust your mindset.

http://www.cco.caltech.edu/%7Ekai/foreignaid.html
However, I concede it is a few years old and it may well be a non event.

This is one of the MANYproblems us fringe dwellers out here have with the American mentality and their introverted perspective regarding the World and it's people.
Pleaseat least hear what we say because above everything else we want to be your friends, equal to and mate's with.

If you see yourselves as our boss, you will make a reluctant enemy of us all.

Regards.......Alan

Johnlocke



That is not what I said... or meant. What I am saying is that a person should follow their own standard, set by their own morality and measured against their conscience.

A persons conscience is the highest of all laws.




I think you may have just contradicted yourself.

Moif,
You can call it a contradiction when we're attacked on US soil again by Bin Laden and when france manages to halt our political globalization by the Bush admin. Two things that I know many europeans are waiting for anyway.

Unfortunately, most of the attacks on the US and US interests are brought on by US action. If the US didn't try to forcibly spread our brand of democracy on countries that have no interest in it, you wouldn't have groups seeking to attack us for it.

But the point of spreading Democracy around to world is to bring peace and stability to violent and unstable world

GA, On one thread you are complaining about spreading our interests out too thin and proposing isolationism and here you are supporting military action for the purpose of spreading democracy around the world.

I would like to ask on this thread (i've done it before) can anybody think of an example of a country successfully implementing democracy before it developed a functioning middle class through a developed economy?

Not me Eeyore.

Johnlocke



And how do you know that?

There may be thousands, even hundreds of thousands of people here who wish harm on the USA. But the majority of European people who wish only the best, for America as well as most every nation on the planet is numbered in the hundred millions!

Your remark is both churlish and uncalled for.

In the form i was proposing Isolationism, i was just making a good platform for a 3rd party in your The New People's Party Thread

How in the heck can you bring peace and stability to a world by destabilizing governments through violent means? Should democracy be imposed or chosen?

Is this the old "destroying the village to save it" philosophy in full effect? Sounds like plain old imperialism to me.

Well, I guess you need the freedom to make that choice in the first place, no? Or were the Iraqis already exercising that 'freedom' when they cast 99.98% of their votes for Sadaam?

As for imperialism, you can only be right if you mean we're exporting freedom.

There will always be opposition in this world. There will always be people passing
judgement on others. Many countires may or may not hate "America", but that should
be of little consequence to us, as Americans. If we are helping them and they don't appreciate it, that's on them. The bigger picture is what we need to focus on. What is the bigger picture? It is the lives we are living, and what we can do, individually, on a daily basis, to help each other. We have children to raise, we have aging parents to take care of, we have spiritual journeys to follow. Who cares what people are
saying about us? The bigger picture is not Foreign Policy. It is not who said what about who. The bigger picture is YOU. Getting distracted by inconsequential rhetoric is time wasted.

mission earth, welcome to the debate!

I think I partially agree with you. Charity should be done regardless of whether the recipient is thankful. The point of charity is not in receiving thanks, it is in giving assistance. If they choose to ignore the good we do, then, as you said, it is on them.


Reference: Nazi Germany. Should we have just beat them back to the borders of the Fatherland, or completely have done away with them?

hmmm, I would agree with you if America followed isolationist policies, however the opposite is true. Most ordinary, rational and decent-minded folk in Latin America, the middle East and elsewhere don't hate America but they extremely distrust American foreign policy motives, actions and detest the ugly reality of American actions in their countries. This is the basis of hostiity to America, not 'they envy our freedom' and so on.

It is of direct consequence for every American, you can't ignore it. American troops are stationed in the heart of the middle East, this is the reality, American actions as far away as Malaysia, Turkestan, Kabul and Baghdad potentially lead to terrorism on the American homeland. That directly effects American men, women and children.

Ignoring these issues and ignoring what your own government does not only does the public any favour, it hypothetically leads to terrorism.

America doing what's right for America must include the consideration of other countries' needs.
We are amidst a global economy, we have financial and moral ties with the outside world. An isolationist
attitude wouldn't have worked in WW2, and it won't work in today's world. Good, bad or indifferent,
we need the support of other countries to expedite our goals as a nation. It's not to say we should
go against what is right for us, we simply must consider what will be the greatest benefit to the world,
as well as our own national needs. WE may be the world's super power now, but if you look back at history, everything changes, so it would behoove us to move forward in a way that is most productive for all countries, and our opinion as to what is most productive is not the only opinion to consider.

Mission Earth,
Welcome. No, America has no reason to consider what is best for other countries. This is a global economy, based on a US economy. So as best as I can tell, other countries better start worrying about what is best for the US.

John Locke,

America is the economic mecca of the world, and we have much advantage and power because of that.
However, with such a power comes responsibility. We are abusing resources, that will one day
come to an end. We have to find a way to come together with other countries to plan for our future.
It is naive to think that the power we now have will always be ours. We have to start looking at the road ahead, and how it can best be paved, and that involves the rest of the world.
We have to be diplomatic and humane in our endeavors with other countries. We can be bullies,
but NOBODY likes a bully. And besides, you can catch more flies with honey than you can with vinegar.

I'm not looking to catch flies, I'm looking for what's best for America, and I might agree with you about several claims you make on how to do that. But American's will be the decision makers for those topics, not europeans!