I'm a Hindu, and I believe in the bible's counterpart called "The vadas" . "veda" means knowledge. Here is a short paraphrase of what veda says -
" God has created man in his own image. Man is an exact replica of God, however with proportions lust, lazyness and hate. Just as a single person cannot efficiently manage an entire nation, God didn't want to single-handedly manage the entire universe. That is why he created the 'prakrithi' - the nature. prakrithi in sanskrit means 'constitution'. The nature, thus has a set of pre-meditated rules like : 'recognize hard work (or) do good to those who help others' . And just like the president can himself interfere in local affairs in special circumstances, so can God , But only when something goes out of control of the nature - the current ruling party. "

How far do you believe this? Does this in anyway contradict The Bible?

angels. from what I understand there are like 9 choirs of them. they operate in a top down fashion with god at the top. one group works as his messengers for example,(it was one of these that told joseph to name his wife's son jesus) another is set up to protect people (ie guardian angels) they have no free will from what I know, and must do as god says. (most are happy to do so)

heck, satan even has minions to do his work.

Could you elaborate, unabomber? I'm not sure I see what point you're trying to make in regards to the questions by discussing angels or their alleged tasks.


Being an atheist I of course don't believe it to any extent, but that is merely my personal position.

In regards to the Bible, I would think the prakrithi as perceived in the Vedas would contradict any similar perception found within the Bible. The Bible makes a point throughout to establish certain codes of conduct which I imagine differ at least once or twice with any Hindu code. In particular there is that bit about accepting Jesus as the son of "the one true God" joined closely with the commandment about worshipping no other God but that "one true God."

There is that. I do see how the pharisees and the average Jew during the time of Jesus thought He was a heretic. The divinity of Jesus unfortunately comes back to that other thread on His mortality and the discussion of whether or not you 1. believe in the literal prophecies of the Old Testaments and 2. if you believe that Jesus fulfilled those prophecies. That is the struggle of faith and as it's been pointed out if you can believe those writings without any physical proof to back them up. It's a matter of perception, I guess.

I do believe in angels, but I don't think God allows them to interfere in the modern world. I see angels as messengers and agents in the Old Testament and very rarely in the New Testament. Though, my belief is that God will use them again during the Tribulation. As of now though, imo, God has pulled back and isn't as involved because the Sacrifice was made and He's biding His time for His second coming. But that's my belief.

first I should state I am not christian(I'm dualistic pantheistic animist) so don't know all there is to know about angels.

he asked if his beliefs that beings did the head guys (in his case "the Vedas) contradicted the bible, and that is what it has to do with it. (because the bible teaches about angels)

I've learned most of what I know of christians beliefs on things from the catholic encyclopedia and here is their page on angels

I made a mistake about the question too, so that may be why my post doesn't make sense in relation to the question. I forgot to respond to the first part.

I do believe that there are spirits, and that they do interact with the physical world, but as a pantheist I don't really believe in an entity god, but rather an all encommpassing energy force. so they don't do what god doesn't want to for whatever reason. so I don't really believe that god has servants.

The 'vedas' infact, goes a step forward and rationalizes the existence of demi-gods. Here's again a paraphrase:

" We see no miracles in day-to-day life, which would not be the case when there is a direct intervention of God himself. Everything seems to obey The law of nature, and there must be someone to enforce these laws. For eg. We say that 'Two bodies attract each other with a force proportional to their masses and inversely propotional to the square of distance between them. WHY??(Even if you give a reason, why does that happen?) Science is incomplete. "

The "vedas" also says that these demi-gods were created with deliberate flaws. That is why things are not "Exactly Perfect" as it must be. If God is directly controlling the happenings on earth, then he, with his powers could easily avoid any mishappenings before it happens. He doesn't do that. He wants the nature to take care of it.

This sounds pretty convincing to me. That also makes sense why some people(like unabomber) believe in pantheism. What do you think?

Sounds pretty convincing in regards to explaining how the world functions? It was once pretty convincing to some that a storm and a flood was punishment from the gods for secret misgivings. There is increasingly less that science cannot explain both here at home and further out into the universe. If, however, a person feels more comfortable assigning explanations for natural phenomenon to a pantheon of demi-gods with flaws to explain the gaps, so be it.

Whew, some of this is a bit above me here, but I must inject the idea of 'free will' . Whether believer or athiest, by natural law humankind has been given, or has by design free will. If we speak of where God bowed out it would be in this realm, or if as atheist, this is still where we take responsability for ourselves as humanity, one planet to care for, one people to care for, so far.

Angels, God or none, we are ultimately responsable for our own collective well being, except for the rules of Nature.

Nature itself creates and destroys ferociously. She as Earth grows and gives all that is needed for life to prosper, yet is fragile and can be mismanaged, leaving us without food, clean air or water. In a moment she can remind us that we are powerless to her energy and a small part of a bigger picture. Nature is adverse to GOD, another entity all together. She has her own life and makes her own rules, shrugging us off in the greatest way when we become a burden.

Maybe there are actually two as Natives believe, God as Creator and Earth as Mother. I dont believe either of them are watching the daily goings on. Perhaps we have our past ancestors watching and helping us, or some other guardian angels, but nothing and noone interferes with the basics of free will.



These laws of nature are very hard to prove but in many religions are accepted as common belief, such as Karma. I dont believe this conflicts with the New Testament at all. This is basically what Jesus taught for the most part.
As far as God interfering in world politics, I have my doubts. The only significant example of this I have ever known, and cannot figure out is the case of Joan of Arc. A time when women were basically chattle, it was illegal to dress as a man, the girl was 14 years old, she led armies to defeat the English and throw them out of France, she was either donned with the light of God and her Saints or such a believer the populace and ruling parties were....bowled over by her confidence? There is always the exception to the rule that throws your theories off.

Do you believe that, someday, science can explain everything? I don't think so. Science begins where transcedental knowledge ends. science begins with certain basic assumptions that no one is supposed to question. science believes in the law of nature. Science as of today, only tries to explain how complex things result by blending these assumptions. Science does not allow us to be skeptical about these basic assumptions.

How does that rebutter my conception?

There are religions, 2 I think, but can only think of one at the moment, that call Christ the son of God and not the same as God. The feeling is that there can be more gods, but those others have other worlds. For this world, there is only one, and we worship him. He has a son, Jesus, but he is not the one we worship.
The Trinity concept as developed by the early church has in its roots the problem of the Jewish faith believing in only one god. If Christianity was to be successful, or at least acceptable to the predominant faith of Judaism, it had to subscribe to the same theory. So the concept of 3 phases of god was developed, as opposed to 3 seperate entities serving the same purpose.
Based on that, God does manages this world indirectly, through Christ, with the Holy Spirit acting as a messenger to those who are receptive to the message.
Don't ask for links or sources, this is all way back in my youth.
Hope I didn't butcher the concepts too much.

" God has created man in his own image."
No problem with this one one its face. The Vedantist's is approaching this realization in the phrase Tat vam asi, That art Thou. Supposedly this hidden man (soul) is identical with Brahman. It might be the same as Adam and Eve being created in the image of God and it could be another version of the old serpents deceptive, ye shall be as god.

"Man is an exact replica of God, however with proportions lust, lazyness and hate."

Christian scholars divide Gods attributes into two cataqories, communicable and incomunicable. Exact replica is a little hard to reconcile to Biblical Christianity. The seperation of God from vice is certainly consistant with Christian theism.

"Just as a single person cannot efficiently manage an entire nation, God didn't want to single-handedly manage the entire universe. "

God in the Old and New Testement has angels, prophets, priests..etc. There is nothing to suggest that He needs them in fact it says that He holds all things together by the word o His power.


How far do you believe this? Does this in anyway contradict The Bible?

I dont think it really contradicting the Bible but there are some important differences.

The fact that he "has" angles, prophets and priests implies that he has created them, doesn't it? Why did he have to?, unless, he needed sub-ordinates.




I don't get it. Does christianity say that there are more than one worlds where living things exit? Does Gods divide, the worlds as we divide nations? Please do clarify.

And this question is yet to be answered:

No, because everything is constantly changing. For instance, while we can know that the atmosphere was different in the past, it is impossible to today understand exactly how that difference effected all forms of life present at the time. It is also impossible for us to understand exactly how things will progress, no matter how high a probability we might arrive at for a prediction. There are simply too many variables.

Not all Christian religions, certainly not, only a few. They beleive in the possiblility of our God having a father or god of his own at some time in the past.
And the concept does not include dividing of God into more gods, but that there has always been other gods, but still only one for this world.
Science will not likely get close to explaining everything; my opinion is that there is more to learn than we can possibly comprehend at this time, and that situation will likely continue forever.

Im not sure what you mean by this.
This will stray off topic a bit, but factually, there have always been other Gods as you say, however, before God was male, ALL Gods were female, for about 8,000 years, much longer than our male God, which right now spans less than 3,000 years. The Trinity was initially the Goddess, her son and consort by the cycles of the moon.
Most Christian belief was co-opted from the pagans, goddess worhippers. Easter for example is co-oped from the Goddess Ester, and eggs from her as sacred object, Spring and the rebirth of life. Christmas is the time of the winter equinox, the time of rebirth of the sun/son? The evergreen tree, was the tree of life in Innanas garden, which never died. The very FIRST translatable writings we have in existance ON THE PLANET, are a poem to the Goddess Innana, of Sumeria, which is now known as Iraq. The Golden Rule also comes from her time. At one time all over the world, God was female. Countries and cities, especially in Europe, are named after Goddesses, yet we dont know this because we are taught only from Greek Civilization, understandably not before. Hellas, the Greek name for Greece is from the goddess Helena of Troy. Danu, is the Goddess which Denmark is named after. ( We couldnt have anyone believing at one time WOMEN were in charge of nations now could we?) Talk of Amazons and other such nonsense must be held as legend.

My point being, there has not always been one God or diversification of one male GOD, for much time all around the world GOD was Female.

Mexicans often say, they are not Christians but 'Guadalupenos'. This refers to the Virgin of Guadalupe, a female worshipped on a goddess site way before the Spanish conquest, and still to this day, but under Christian ritual.

In Ireland and England you can still see on churches the Sheila'Na Gig, a gargoyle who is opening her privates, a symbol to the birth mother and fielty to the Goddess.

http://www.goddesscafe.com/yoni/sheila.html

Would I believe Science can explain everything, absloutely not. The greatest scientists including Albert Einstein believed in a creative force. Possibly not GOD as overseeer, but energy, to use as free will, make of it as you may, and recieve good or bad, or your perception of it all, the consequences. Some Scientific rules do apply, such as every action has an equal and opposite reaction. I believe this to be true, which to me sounds more spiritual than scientific, yet it stands as science, but strangely relates to Karma. Maybe the two are intertwined.