Georges Monbiot wrote an article about america being a religion:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,...1007741,00.html
What do you think of this statement? Do you feel that, as american, or not? Can you explain it? Do you think it's an accurate view of contemporary america or not?

So much to say, so little time..

The Guardian is very anti-US for the most part, and liberal left in Brittain, yet often they do have something to say. This article, in my mind is one of their most biased, since England backed us all the way in our quest to rid the world of Saddam Hussein, to invade and occupy another nation, based currently on the idea of 'liberating' others, since the WMD issue has gone under the Bridge of Troubled Waters.

Brittain did support, supposedly based on threat, not a spiritual cause and Tony Blair has never to my knowlege brought God into the picture. He, quite responsably sticks to the idea of invasion and removal as practical and necessary. Different from Americans, so I elaborate...

I think the collective USA does suffer some degree of self righteousness and adjunct hypocrisy in our dealings with the rest of the world. We certainley sit on a very high horse when preaching our freedom and democracy, as we erode the freedoms of the very same peoples trying to bring freedom to the rest of the world.
Our current Commander in Chief mentioning that God told him to rid the world of this terrible dictator is scary in and of itself. I dont expect my nation to be led by the personal talks between God and the sitting Executive. This is somewhat looney. I expect it to be based on reliable information and long term thought as to the outcome and if we can support and carry through our intentions.

I think many Americans believe we should lead the world because we believe our base values are correct, yet as a nation we cant even decide what our values are for ourselves. The US sponsors terrorism, and remains friendy to terrorist nations when it suits us, so we are hypocrites in this aspect.

Fanatics of all kinds are dangerous to the well being of the planet, whether they be Christian, Muslim, Zionist, Democratic, Communist or Fascist; sometimes its difficult to see the ironies in between, especially when actively trying to export ideals. It is very dangerous that a single population or country begins to believe they have 'the one and only answer for all people, all the time'. The US is skirting on that belief and therefore leading themselves down a path of wrong thinking and hence, wrong conduct. Suddenly, one is not liberator but oppressor, not democtratic but fascist. This has ultimately been the downfall of all previously great civilizations. Cultures will reach for their OWN set of ideals about right and wrong, on their own evolutionary ladder, and will fight for them or against YOU especially if you are an imposing source. The Brits have learned this lesson already in Iraq, its a suprise they went back for more punishment.

Democracy is NOT an imposed ideal by armies. It is a choice. When Democracy is imposed militarily it is no longer Democracy. IE: The situation we will have in Iraq for a LONG time. Trying to impose beliefs on people who want nothing to do with your way of life is an excersize in frustration, and very expensive. It may come to fruition, but not without great long term investment and the suspension of the very Democratic values from which the situation began.
Of course thats in the philisophical sense, since in my belief the invasion of Iraq had nothing to do with Democracy, but blatant theft of resouces and a weakly thought out plan to get the US permanently into the mid-east beyond Israel and to subvert Saudi power over the oil block.

Read the article, hated it. Well, hate is a hard word. I think it is stupid rhetoric taken out of context to support more stupid rhetoric.
So many people have a need to say something, so much so that they will make up things to say. And if you dig far and wide, you can collect enough words and phrases spoken by influential persons to support any wild ideas or thoughts of your own.

No, America is not a religion, secular or otherwise. What our leaders say, today or in the past, is based in part on who they are speaking to at the moment. Any good, or I should say smart , politician will include something in every speech that will appeal to the religious among the constituency, whether he believes his own words or not.

George is overreaching his own ability to present an argument.

I think some people do support the "war on terrorism" with a religious fervor. I have heard and read some very harsh criticism of those of us who opposed the war. Our very presence as the loyal opposition seemed to threaten people, who accused us of not being loyal to our country.

We who opposed the war weren't condemning the troops. We want them back home. We opposed the President waging a pre-emptive war on a country that was never proven to be connected to the 9/11 attacks.

In times of hostilities, any old enemy WON'T do.

(edited)

Way over the top, but not completely mistaken either.

Of those points I can agree with:


I think Mr. Monbiot made accurate observations of America, but did not paint an accurate picture of America on the whole. While America is not a religion, and is not becoming a religion, certain ideologies are playing much too large a role in our foreign policy.

While our soldiers are not missionaries, as referred to in the article, I find it true that any resistance will be blamed on Saddam Hussein rather than even look at the possibility some of it is merely a result of our presence. The demonization can, and I believe has, led us away from some other issues facing us in Iraq.

I agree that since September 11 people have been more open to the idea of America being that "beacon on the hill" for the rest of the world. I don't view this to be a product simply of religion but also of superiority. We've been at the top for a while, we've had great successes, so why shouldn't people perceive America to be blessed with a purpose? It's a faulty way of thinking, but I can understand where it comes from.

If we wish to continue to stick around, however, we'll have to step off the high horse. As much as Bush may or may not view us to be some great redeemer of the world, there is also a great deal to be said about humility. We can't seek to change the world at the tip of a sword the way Rome did, but rather seek to change it the way Jesus might have ideally done.

We should exercise caution in adopting the thinking of theology into our foreign policy. It has proved disasterous in the past with nothing to indicate a change in fortune for the future. Again, while I think Monbiot made some excellent observations, I also believe he made a mistake, and lost much of his audience, by trying to apply it in too large a scope (America as a religion).

This is what actualy make people feel this about america. In Europe, few politicians would use this sort of language, because it would certainly backtfire, as many here think that religion is a private matter that has nothing to do with politics.
Something you have to understand too is that the view of america abroad is not your view of america, what most of people know about america come form the speeches of Georges Bush, Donald Rumsfeld and co, from CNN and, yes, Fox News, and that we don't here the voice of the opposition. So what georges Monbiot wrote is a common thought of many people, and you 'd better watch out, because it could backfire (and will surely).
You can surely understand that watching Fox News is very appaling for a foreigner, and when newspapers tell you that all americans think like that, it could be frightening (eventhougt many people know that's not true)