Can somebody, anybody explain to me why the California ACLU is filing a lawsuit to remove punch card ballot machines from counties with overwhelming minority populations?

The ACLU had filed a similar suit after the 2000 national election requiring them to be removed by the March 2004 primary election.

Link

Does anyone have a breakdown of which counties throughout the state still use these machines?

If in fact only the counties that are listed by the ACLU have punch card ballots, which do have heavy minority concentrations, why isn't the ACLU claiming that white voters in those counties would be disenfranchised also?

Obviously this is only my opinion, but I would feel a little offended if a group claiming to represent my voting rights made it sound as if I was incapable of reading a ballot or using a punch tool.

We have the accu-vote system here now, but had the punch card style years ago- and I have had to have ballots destroyed and start over with mistakes made, just because it was easy to jump a line off when following it over- if it is the same kind we used. Even here in Alaska- when I lived in the ONLY "poor" nieghborhood, a place called Mt.View, it was kind of our very small crime nieghborhood, I noticed when I voted there, the machines and equipment were much older and harder to use than the rest of the precincts I voted in later. I always wondered about that. Maybe the ACLU is on to something.......

I think that all voting machines should be standardized and the same across the US

I'm curious as to why the voting rights of minorities are more important than the voting rights of whites?

The ACLU, who touts their fight for civil liberties for everyone, should be filing a lawsuit to have all counties upgraded to a better voting system or none at all.

That is kind of a "duh" question- whites don't have a history of systematic attempts to deny them the right to vote! Whites run this country, period, and there is no one saying that whites, except for possibly the elderly voters in Florida, might have even attempted this.

Attempted what??
The question was....how do punch card ballots disenfranchise minority voters?

Are they not as bright as white voters? Can they not manipulate a punch tool? Can't read a ballot? I would think not, yet the ACLU would have you believe that this is the case.
I really don't think that kind hearted liberals think that either, this is yet another ploy in an election that isn't going their way.

Let's not forget, that there are white voters in these counties with the punch cards, who is standing up for their voting rights?
I just can't get over how groups who stand for the rights of minorities would paint them as stupid.

DUH.

DTOM, I think you are reading the article wrong. When I read it, my first thought was that they were referring to the fact that in those counties with high concentrations of minorities, the older machines are being used - not that the machines should ONLY be replaced in minority counties.

This paragraph



seems to be talking about all the voters. I really think the problem is not one of racial preference on the part of the ACLU. Rather, it is a condemnation of the fact that in counties where minorities are concentrated, the balloting systems are old and faulty.

DTOM says:


I agree, there CAN be that mentality - like people who claim that the lottery is a "tax on the poor," as if poor people were somehow incapable of making choices. I don't see it here, however. I think you're coming from a predisposed aversion to the ACLU (and as a Libertarian, I really don't see why on earth that would be), and hence reading things into this.

Here's a series of statements for figuring this one out:

1. Poor counties or areas are more likely to have outdated ballot boxes, in particular, machines faulty enough to be a real interference in the electoral process.

2. Sadly, "poor counties" and areas tend to be demographically dominated by minorities.

3. Something tells me in Beverly Hills they aren't using these old punch card ballots.

4. Hence this suit.

What the ACLU would actually have us believe is the truth: these machines are old and faulty; they are in mostly minority areas; they need to be replaced. My understanding is that these machines cause problems for everyone who uses them - not just the "dumb" minorities.

I'm curious as to why the ACLU is under the assumption that Minoritiescan't get the concept of puching holes.

Does anyone know what alternative the ACLU is advocating? Are they even advocating a solution or are they just pointing out a problem? I can't seem to a find a copy of this complaint online so I don't know what reliefs or remedies have been requested of the Court.

I ask because after reading Platypus' well researched posts in this thread: Vote Rigging, The fix is in, I'm not convinced electronic ballots are a proper alternative. What is the goal of the ACLU? What do they hope to achieve?

I'm even MORE curious as to why Johnlocke assumes that the ACLU assumes minorities are stupid.

From the ACLU link:


AND

Smells like a delaying tactic to me...