Full Version: France to cancel Christmas?
France is mulling over the idea of cancelling a national holiday in order to finance the ever increasing social burdens over there. This has been sparked by the recent deaths of thousands of elderly people in the heat wave of the summer.
Will France Scrap Christmas?
How foreign that people would need to work to pay for things...
Question for debate: Do you think that people should be forced to work more in order to fund social programs?
Will France Scrap Christmas?
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France, a country where leisure time is sacrosanct, is mulling a radical plan for financing health care after a heat wave estimated to have killed thousands: Make people work on a national holiday.
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On the political left, there was outrage.
"There's no question of touching holidays," thundered Communist lawmaker Alain Bocquet. "There's no question of erasing May 8 and the memory of victory over Nazi barbarity and fascism!"
Jean-Claude Mailly, a leader of the Workers' Force trade union, said a wealthy country like France should not have to make workers labor longer to finance health care. The union, he warned, would not take kindly to the abolition of the May 1 Labor Day holiday.
"It's enforced charity, totally unacceptable," he said in an interview.
But Ernest-Antoine Seilliere, president of MEDEF, France's leading business federation, said one less holiday would be "fantastic."
"The idea that we can solve problems by working more is a big first for our country," he said on Europe-1 radio. "We all know that the time has passed for the illusion that we can be more united and make the French system function, eyeing leisure time all the while."
"There's no question of touching holidays," thundered Communist lawmaker Alain Bocquet. "There's no question of erasing May 8 and the memory of victory over Nazi barbarity and fascism!"
Jean-Claude Mailly, a leader of the Workers' Force trade union, said a wealthy country like France should not have to make workers labor longer to finance health care. The union, he warned, would not take kindly to the abolition of the May 1 Labor Day holiday.
"It's enforced charity, totally unacceptable," he said in an interview.
But Ernest-Antoine Seilliere, president of MEDEF, France's leading business federation, said one less holiday would be "fantastic."
"The idea that we can solve problems by working more is a big first for our country," he said on Europe-1 radio. "We all know that the time has passed for the illusion that we can be more united and make the French system function, eyeing leisure time all the while."
How foreign that people would need to work to pay for things...
Question for debate: Do you think that people should be forced to work more in order to fund social programs?
As a Frenchman, living in France, I don't mind having one day taken from my vacation time if it gives enough money to the state to finance a special kind of welfare for elderly people.
The unions' behavior is immoral, given the current state of our economy. Everybody needs to make efforts to improve the situation. I'm ready to do my share of the job. One more day of work won't kill me, but it may ensure that others survive!
The unions' behavior is immoral, given the current state of our economy. Everybody needs to make efforts to improve the situation. I'm ready to do my share of the job. One more day of work won't kill me, but it may ensure that others survive!
Most European countries have much more sensible and liberal vacation policies than the United States. Working an extra day isn't going to hurt. Perhaps the fear there is that once taken, such a step will either expand or at least not be repealed.
I love your question, by the way:
Well, in America, many people are forced to work more in order to cut costs and increase profits for the executives of their companies. Personally, I'd rather work extra in order to help those in need, than in order to say, fund a new missile, or fund a new yacht for the CEO.
Indeed, I like the idea of having one day where everyone works for a united cause, and where the bulk of their pay goes towards a particular social program. Think how much money could be raised if almost every working person in the US were to give eight hours of pay to the same cause! Of course the biggest problem is if it were mandatory... so make it optional, and run a PR campaign to sell it. Each year, something different - cancer research, scholarship funds, meals on wheels, Food Stamps. I think you'd be surprised at how many people would do it.
I love your question, by the way:
QUOTE
Do you think that people should be forced to work more in order to fund social programs?
Well, in America, many people are forced to work more in order to cut costs and increase profits for the executives of their companies. Personally, I'd rather work extra in order to help those in need, than in order to say, fund a new missile, or fund a new yacht for the CEO.
Indeed, I like the idea of having one day where everyone works for a united cause, and where the bulk of their pay goes towards a particular social program. Think how much money could be raised if almost every working person in the US were to give eight hours of pay to the same cause! Of course the biggest problem is if it were mandatory... so make it optional, and run a PR campaign to sell it. Each year, something different - cancer research, scholarship funds, meals on wheels, Food Stamps. I think you'd be surprised at how many people would do it.
Count me out. I live paycheck to paycheck as it is, I can be woken up in the middle of the night to come help update 1200 machines(recently happened), several times I've worked two days straight(no sleep), I need all the time-off I can get. It's not so bad knowing I'm getting overtime, but to not get paid at all? The answer is no.
Will France scrap Christmas?
To coin a phrase - Bah! Humbug!
How terrible that the mean old French socialists should even contemplate (all that they're doing at this stage) asking people to work one more day. when they get a statutory minimum of 20 days paid vacation (on top of public holidays), and the majority of whom have a statutory 35 hour hour maximum working week, and, despite their current economic downturn, still have rates of productivity and productivity increase outdone only by the USA in the developed world.
What a shocking indictment of the perils of big government and socialist-inspired policy.
Personally, I prefer the idea of using productivity increases to make people's lives nicer to the Anglo-Saxon ideal of working 60+ hours a week in order to increase someone else's stock prices and dividends.
To coin a phrase - Bah! Humbug!
How terrible that the mean old French socialists should even contemplate (all that they're doing at this stage) asking people to work one more day. when they get a statutory minimum of 20 days paid vacation (on top of public holidays), and the majority of whom have a statutory 35 hour hour maximum working week, and, despite their current economic downturn, still have rates of productivity and productivity increase outdone only by the USA in the developed world.
What a shocking indictment of the perils of big government and socialist-inspired policy.
Personally, I prefer the idea of using productivity increases to make people's lives nicer to the Anglo-Saxon ideal of working 60+ hours a week in order to increase someone else's stock prices and dividends.
Seems to me that sacrificing the one holiday to help others in need fits right into the real Christmas spirit. Good for them! As long as it doesn't have to be done every year.
I tend towards the optional work day, for different causes every year. Or even different causes chosen by each individual business.
However, another option would be to pay workers regular wages for working a holiday, and giving their overtime pay to a good cause. That way, at least the workers are getting paid for their time, and charities are getting a fairly decent chunk of cash. I do believe that forcing people to work on holidays is a fairly bad idea. Anyone even close to liberal-minded would be in an uproar in a matter of seconds, and anyone with a family, an active social life, who is lazy, or just downright greedy, would not want to work. And since my list incorporates the vast majority of people, it's a safe bet that, if put to vote, this would never fly with the general population.
However, another option would be to pay workers regular wages for working a holiday, and giving their overtime pay to a good cause. That way, at least the workers are getting paid for their time, and charities are getting a fairly decent chunk of cash. I do believe that forcing people to work on holidays is a fairly bad idea. Anyone even close to liberal-minded would be in an uproar in a matter of seconds, and anyone with a family, an active social life, who is lazy, or just downright greedy, would not want to work. And since my list incorporates the vast majority of people, it's a safe bet that, if put to vote, this would never fly with the general population.
I personally think there is at least one holiday that we could do without to help further social initiatives, in fact I don't think we should celebrate it at all. I'm speaking of course of Columbus Day. Why do we celebrate a day for a man who enslaved, tortured, and otherwise abused the natives of Hispanola? Well, that's beside the point I suppose, but it does serve to illustrate the fact that we celebrate some very unworthy holidays which I'm sure we could do without.
Scrap Christmas? They are considering removing Armistice day or VE day, two days we Americans don't have. Saying they are going to remove Christmas is just an emtional yet not factual appeal.
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Debate question:
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Debate question:
QUOTE
Do you think that people should be forced to work more in order to fund social programs?
Please remember to keep it civil and on topic.
QUOTE(Jaime @ Sep 1 2003, 03:14 AM)
REOPENED.
Debate question:
Please remember to keep it civil and on topic.
Debate question:
QUOTE
Do you think that people should be forced to work more in order to fund social programs?
Please remember to keep it civil and on topic.
As far as the U.S. is concerned I would say no. The American workforce as a whole is already overworked. On average we put in more work hours and take less vacation than any of the nations in Western Europe, and even Japan. We could do with a little more vacation, and a little less time spent on a daily basis at the office/factory.
In France's case, I don't see anything wrong with losing a holiday in order to help their countrymen. France has more liberal vacation policies than most nations in the world. It won't hurt them to sacrifice a day or two.
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Vacation Deprivation
No, humans should not be forced to do anything against their will or by majority vote, then their is reality. I see the good in this in that the society of France would give up a day of individual entertainment to some icon worship or barbaric tradition to support humanity in a time of crisis.
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