Do you think prostitution should be legal?

I don't think that prostitution should be legal. I, unfortunately, book more than my share of prostitutes at work; and not one of them are prostitutes because they love having sex with random gross men. . .in almost every case it is to support their drug habit, and/or they were sexually mistreated by a male family member as a child and made to think that that was all they were good for. It is a demeaning and pathetic way to make a living that only causes more problems. It is sad that there is such a demand for their services, maybe if their "johns" saw women as people and not objects they would get laid without having to pay for it.

-Kisov

I think that prostitution should be legal or at least decriminalized. It is the oldest profession and regardless of the laws that are passed, it will not go away. Women, men, and transgenders engage in prostitution for many different reasons, but regardless of what those reasons are, it is still a personal choice that people are making. If it were legal, it could be more easily regulated, specifically with medical testing for STDs, for the protection of both the prostitutes and their clientelle.

Of course, legalizing it would not aleviate all of the problems associated with it, because there will always be people who choose not to be a part of the system, and some prostitutes would not like the idea of paying taxes on their wages. Still, I think that legalizing it would encourage some prostitutes to take advantage of the protections that it would provide to them.

The only reasons I have ever heard for it to not be legal are all moot points. For those people that say it's unsafe, there are ways to regulate it just like requirements in every kitchen in every restaurant. ofcourse there will be people and businesses that disobey these rules but what industry doesn't have people breaking rules on any given day. By making it a "legitimate" job they wouldn't be using the money for drugs any more than a college kid working at Gap an actor. Thats like saying that if marijuana was legalized the people that profit from it would only use the money to buy hot pockets and jolt.

Prostitution has been around for as long as I can remember. Should it be legal? My thought would be to say no. It is degrading to women. I think the only men who use a prostitute is a loser. Cyan suggests regulated it. How? Guns are supposed to be controlled. There is no gun control. Drugs are illegal. Guess what there are drugs being sold also out of control. Do you think prostitutes will be willing to pay taxes? Admit that is their profession? I think not.

Prostitution is degrading to some women, but there are some women who honestly want to be involved in the sex industry. Additionally, whether or not men who use prostitutes for sex are losers is irrelevant. There is a market for sex, and both parties in the sexual exchange are consensual.

By legalizing prostitution, women would have legal recourse if their johns or pimps abused them. They could work in controlled bordello environments that provide testing for STDs, and they would have more ability to screen their clientelle. Bordellos would have to compete in a free market, forcing them to up their standards.

There's also the cost to consider. How much money do tax payers spend trying to keep prostitutes off of the streets, and how much does it cost to keep them in the jails? Also, is it really effective?

As far as admitting their profession is concerned, a woman wouldn't have to straight up say that she is a prostitute. Exotic dancers and porn stars call themselves entertainers. The same would apply to prostitutes. The only people that need to know the exact form of entertainment are the employers, the johns, and whatever agencies would be involved in licensing the ladies or bordellos.

I tend to agree with Cyan. Legislating prostitution is another example of way too obtrusive government interference what one does with one's own body.

Are there any sound arguments for criminalizing prostitution? Not that I've heard. It would be safer for everyone involved, there would be at least some additional tax revenue, and a whole criminal class would be eliminated, possibly along with associated crimes. The thriving sex industry is often the only job opportunity for people with limited options who would otherwise be poverty-stricken - and a legal status could further reduce unemployment.

Momof3 opposes the legalization of prostitution on the grounds that it is degrading to women. Is illegal prostitution less degrading than legal prostitution? And in what way are male prostitutes degrading to women?

Have any of you guys out there, that think Prostitution should be legal, actually have dealt with a prostitute. I, unfortunately, see at least one a day at my job. It is nothing but pathetic; these people don't enjoy their job. They are all strung out on drugs, and are selling themselves for cash to support their habit. It just is not right to buy and sell flesh. These women are not out their on the corner because they "honestly want to be involved in the sex industry" as cyan puts it. And to call it a "sex industry" like it is some kind of legitimate business; what is that? This "industry" only demeans women, setting the feminist movement back with every BJ that is bought. Do you actually think these "johns" think that the women they buy/beat are anything more than an object?

-Kisov

Obviously making prostitution illegal is not stopping people from being prostitutes. However, I wonder if making it legal would encourage even more prostitution.

I stand on the fence right now, but my choice would be based upon whether making it legal or illegal would cause less prostitution. So, if it can be shown that making it legal would decrease prostitution, then I'd be for it.

Well there you have it, the votes are in:

5 to 1, prostitution should be legal.

I can now say that "the majority of Americans are pro-prostitution".

Thanks everyone!

Mike

Of course prostitution should be legal. It doesn't matter if the prostitutes are "pathetic", or that it is "degrading". There are plenty of professions that are both of those things (working in a fast food resturaunt), but they are still legal . Job enjoyment is irrelevant, also.

The fact is that it would make it a safer working environment for the people in that industry. Regardless of your personal opinion on prostitution, which is better: a prostitute that is regularly tested, wears condoms, has laws protecting her/him in the face of abuse, or prostituion now (no testing, no laws for protection and no condoms.)?

Also being a prostitute or being involved in the sex industry (and there a legitimate sex industry, its called porn. its legal, safe and thriving) does not set back the feminist movement, that is ridiculous. Not allowing women to sell their time the way they want to is setting back the feminist movement (partially because there are more child MALE prostitutes than there are female prostitutes) Im not trying to romanticize the life of a prostitute at all, and I realize that most in that people in that profession are disfunctional and would not want to be there. Its a sad life to live, but sadder still by the fact that they are not alloted any protection for their work. I guess its better for a woman to sell herself and let all the money go to her pimp, than to let that woman sell herself, keep her money and pay some taxes.

I truly believe most women would pay taxes, if prostutition was legalized. I think they would be grateful to be treated like regular humans in a working industry than not.

Sorry - I'd missed this question. But, yes, I have. One of my foster sons was a male prostitute when we met him (this was in Dublin). His girlfriend was also a prostitute. Both were heroin addicts and, yes, were relying on prostitution to support their habits (which, at least, was better than, say, armed robbery or housebreaking). I also met a number of their "colleagues", many of whom were not addicts. Previously, in New York, I knew a dozen or so people who worked in the porn industry, which was supplemented by prostitution. I don't know of any of these people who were drug addicts.

Granted, people who support addiction through prostitution are more to be pitied than censured. However, the fact that a percentage of prostitutes may also be IV drug users is all the more reason to get this industry legalized and regulated. The threat of AIDS alone should be enough to warrant practitioners of the oldest profession being subject to regular medical check-ups - as they are in Germany, the Netherlands and other places where prostitution is legal or decriminalized.

As many addicts would be faced with either seeking treatment/rehab or seeking other means of income should prostitution be legal, I imagine we'd see a decrease in either the number of prostitutes, the number of addicts, or both.

Those engaged in the sex industry would at least be paying taxes and would be less subject to abuse by pimps and johns alike. Prostitution, if legalized, would be safer for everyone involved.

Wertz, do you know of any studies showing that legalization of prostitution would cause a decrease in prostitution? If there is sufficient evidence for this, I'd be for it's legalization.

Kisov - I have known prostitutes, and it is true that the majority of them that I've know have been supporting a drug habit...not all. Right or wrong, I would rather see these people supporting their drug habit in this manner than by robbing individuals or companies. If their body is their greatest asset, let them use it. They are going to do it regardless of whether prostitution is legal or not. Wouldn't it be better to regulate the industry, test for diseases, screen the clientelle, and get rid of the pimps which pocket the majority of the cash while the women do all the work? Of course, there will still be some illegal activity, but I think by legalizing prostitution, some of the negative aspects that are attached it would be reduced.

cyan you say if prostitution was legal a woman would have more recourses against their pimps. and that some woman like the sexual industry. ( dancers, strippers) I think not only should prostitution be illgal but so should pimps. and I really don't think these women like their "profession". From what Kisov says many are on drugs. Do you think they think with a clear mind? Buy supporting their habits with sex I can bet my life many had Aids. Do you think they practice "safe sex"? I think not. They are on drugs and they cannot think with a clear head. Then what happens when they get to be the age of 45-50 maybe younger? Now no one wants an "old" woman. And that is if they make it that long. ( they might me dead of Aids or their drug habit by now). They now go on Welfare? Collect Social Security? And then there is the pimp. He is still having his prostitutes. He doesn't give a rats *** NOTICE: THIS WORD IS AGAINST THE RULES. FAILURE TO REMOVE IT WILL RESULT IN A STRIKE. *** if they die or no one wants them anymore and his is a very rich man for selling women. That to you is not degrading???

There are many women and men who find prostitution to be a degrading profession. I don't deny that, but it is still a choice that they are making. It's illegal, and it is still happening. If it wasn't, it would be a non-issue. Also, I'm sure that you're correct that many of these men and women have AIDS and other sexually transmitted diseases, which is exactly the reason why it should be regulated. Let's get these men and women into the system, paying taxes and do what we can to reduce the risk of disease and unwanted pregnancy.

As far as the drugs are concerned, a junkie will do what he/she has to do to get the cash to support his/her habits. I am more willing to accept someone giving blow jobs in an alley than robbing some convenience store clerk at gun point. At least prostitution is a consensual act between two adults.

I would also like to add that I know exotic dancers who love their jobs. They enjoy the attention that they receive, and they make a lot of money in the process. Most of these women are quite aware of the fact that their time in the industry is limited, and the girls that I know are paying their way through school, and putting away money for the future. Exotic dancing is a bit different than prostitution, of course.

Please understand that I'm not suggesting that women and men become prostitutes. There are much better career choices, in my opinion, but the fact is that there are people who are making that choice for whatever reason. It has been that way since the dawn of civilization, and I don't see it stopping anytime in the near future.

I was rereading everyone's thoughts on this subject. Since I noticed one argument in favor of legalization was left out, I tought I should add my two cents.

First, I will say I support the legalization of prostitution. This is primarily based on my free-market philosophy and has already been articulated by the many pro-capitalism arguments already presented by others in this thread. It is one's body, if they want to make money from it so be it.

The argument that is missing in this respect is the fact that there are people currently making money from a prostitute. It's not just the pimps. Let us not forget the defense attorneys, vice officers, and court-ordered counselors who make money off of a prostitute's work. I will concede that the amount they get from that sort of work is minimal, but they are making it nonetheless. The hypocrisy is apparant.

There are people interested in keeping prostitution illegal because it keeps the money in their own pockets instead of the person who earned it - the prostitute.

I still have the question what happens when they get to an age when they are no longer wanted? and you can bet it will not be at 65. Retirement age. It will be and I am giving a long shot here about 40. I think sooner. What then? Welfare? Full social security? You can regulate all you want. It will not work!

Not offhand, sorry, no. I can look into it, if you like. But I do know that in Amsterdam and Berlin prostitution is confined to licensed houses and call sevices. One almost never sees streetwalkers. The houses themselves (outside of the touristy "red light districts") are quite discreet. There's certianly less evident prostitution, though I suspect its incidence is a matter of supply and demand. The prostitutes in those cities are all licensed and their business regulated. Most of the houses have a "manager" whose business is also regulated - there's very little exploitation of the workers themselves - by pimps or johns. There's also very little drug use among the prostitutes (no more than among, say, data processors, nurses, or any other working professionals) and they all practice safe sex - by law. (Though even crack whores on the streets of Dublin know enough to keep well-stocked with condoms - these people are addicts, not idiots.)

The exact same question could be asked of professional models or dancers or athletes. You would hardly suggest criminalizing gymnastics - or the Rockettes - on the basis of the limited lifespan of the career.

Many prostitutes (and I have known of women working into their fifties - the lifespan appears to be shorter for male prostitutes) in countries like the Netherlands use it as supplementary income - while working their way through school or other training. Many then move on to other careers. Many marry. And some, yes, burn themselves out and end up on Social Welfare. Same as other professions with little longevity. I had a "summer romance" with a prostitute in Berlin for a while (not as paying client, mind you) who was also a musician. When he eventually found a steady gig playing with a quartet in an upscale hotel (shortly after we met), he gave it up. A few of his friends worked for several months each year, saved their earnings, then took several months off - supplementing their savings by working as waiters or bartenders as necessary. Some were investing a fair amount of money each month. One had saved enough to open a café/bookstore. Most of them were financially better off than I was - and I was working full-time as a production designer for TV (a profession in which I only lasted for eight years).


Elsewhere, it does!

Right on, sister!

Legalize it, absolutely. The government shouldn't be allowed to tell anybody what they can or cannot do with his/her body. At least with legalization, there could be mandatory testing for diseases, required condom use, etc... Legalizing it could greatly assist in slowing the spread of HIV, and other illnesses. Not to mention the fact that it would help to combat the rising budget deficit.
Nevada has proven that legalization helped to reduce strain on police departments, creates large amounts of tax revenue, and nearly eliminated the "street corner hustler" as we know them. I honestly can't find any information pointing to a negative impact that it has had. People sometimes need to look past their own morals to see what is right in front of them. The "profession" will always exsist, but as a society, we can make it safer, and possibly even a little less degrading.

Some points I would like to make:

It's degrading - What gives you the right to tell a person how they should feel about their own body? I think living on welfare and accepting handouts is degrading. That should be a personal opinion, not yours.

They wreck homes - What about the man who has an affair with his secretary? Maybe being a secretary should be illegal. And why don't we place blame where it belongs, on the person who is doing the cheating. They are the homewreckers. If my husband were to cheat, I would much rather he hire a prostitute for his physical needs than to get emotionally involved with someone for sex. And what about the single guy who pays for sex?

Legalizing it will increase the number of prostitutes - Maybe, but I bet it would decrease the number of men who cheat. If more women thought it was ok to get paid for it, more women would charge for it. There are always a number of men who think it's ok to have sex for free but would "never" pay for it. That, and they wouldn't cheat because they couldn't afford it.

Keeping this a criminal act is not helping anyone. Women do it for different reasons, to help pay for school, to keep food on their table and a roof over their heads. You don't know. Giving them a criminal record has just made it next to impossible for them to get a good job. Hence back out on the street they go to be able to eat. They can work at McDonalds or somewhere you say? Oh yea, that pays the bills in todays economy. Especially if you have kids. And for these women who have pimps or are on drugs, they need our help, not our censure.

No because Prostitution is one way that STD's can be spread, mostly AIDS

Africa is a prime example of this

Then lets just ban sex all together. No more worries about STD's and AIDS. Too far? Then lets ban homosexuality, I hear it it more prominent in that community. Last I heard you can still buy condoms over the counter. Oh, maybe we should ban that too since it promotes sex and isn't 100% effective.

Where is the eye roll smilie?

That is an outrageous accusation. Could you provide us with ANY proof?

Prostitution & AIDS

Don't forget Amsterdam as a source of information regarding prostitution and drug legalization. I'm of the mind that one goes with the other: Both need to be legalized for either to work the best.

Criminalizing social behavior pushes the behavior underground. Criminilization creates opportunities for crime where none existed before. We could criminalize alcohol--and we have--and this principle was verified. However, we did not learn the lesson of that experiment.

Is prostitution necessarily degrading? I don't think so. I can imagine a successful business where the woman or man can pick and choose clientele. What if clients had to fill out an application and go through an interview before receiving services? What if an STD card was required? The sex drive is such that clients could be required to jump through any number of hoops to get the prize. However, I do concur that prostitution as we now have it--criminalized--is degrading and will always be degrading, as long as it remains criminalized.

The age situation has been brought up. Well, I'm over 50 and apparently this is working against me to find a technical job similar to what I had before layoff. Ageism isn't just for prostitutes. This is a whole different issue, but prostitutes and other workers have this problem in common. Some people age more attractively than others, and that's just the human condition; however, job prospects for physically attractive older people are better than we who look rode hard and put away wet.

I'm not convinced that prostitution spreads STDs like AIDS any more than other sexual activity. Where are the supporting statistics? We have none because prostitution is illegal. We only have half-baked guesses.

The arguments against legalization seem to be circular in nature: prostitution is degrading, it spreads STDs, it promotes criminal behavior. Yes, all true--while it remains illegal.

One thing all seem to agree with: Sexual molestation of children has nothing to do with prostitution, but it is often a precursor to prostitution.

Regarding the demand for commercial sex, well, you need to talk to our Creator about that. The demand is built into the species. That's why we procreate so much--other animals have procreation seasons. Not humans. We will and do procreate anywhere and at any time.

Not only this, we have invented drugs to prolong this procreation activity far past our natural ages of procreation.

And these drugs are not only legal but promoted by a former presidential candidate.

Does this sound like the behavior of a sane society?

Thank you for the link, ga. I would be more interested in seeing a fair comparision, though. The places mentioned in your link were where prostitution was illegal.

In light of your information, my logic would indicate that we should legalize it in order to clean up the industry.

http://www.non-trivial.com/f_std.htm

Sorry didn't mean to double quote in the above...

I think it's important to stay away from generalizations regarding the prostitution community. Many are unaware this community is comprised of a very diverse population with varying education backgrounds, values, emotional issues, intelligence, motivations, beliefs, etc.

There's limited data on the community because it's an underground network. Most of the comparisons in this thread relate to the street hooker, strung out on drugs. I'm actually surprised that there is support to legalizing the agencies because those business actually are only one step above steet prostitution -- with many girls being paid very little for their time and some being extorted.

All prostitutes are referred to as "providers" in the community. (Before you start laughing about the label of "provider", you might want to wait until you hear what a client is referred to and actually calls himself -- that comes later.) There are varying levels of providers from street girls to agencies to another segment to this population that's called an "independent provider."

The independent is a women (or man but for this posting I'm sticking with women) that doesn't work for an agency but herself. She isn't a street walker. Many of these women are well educated, stable women. They are actually brilliant business women because the career involves accounting, marketing, advertising, scheduling, legal research, health research, networking, screening -- everything it takes to run a successful business.

They actually pay taxes too because they live high lifestyles and need to account for their income. Many independents earn over 100k a year. The actual "office" time is a few days per month. Don't get jealous they earn so much money for the small portion of time spent with "hobbyists" (yes, that's what the men are called) because the independent provider spends endless hours performing administrative tasks.

Many of the comments in this thread that more accurately depict streetwalkers are also voiced by the independent provider. The independent provider would much prefer for the business to be legalized because they are concerned with the activities of others in the profession.

Unprotected intercourse (vaginal or anal) is very rare. It's considered a death wish in the provider side of the community. Unfortunately, unprotected oral is a little more common. The prevelance really depends ont the region and how well networked providers are in a specific city. If it's a highly networked city, then the prevelance is lower because the girls stick together on policy. If it's not a highly networked city, then there are a percentage of providers that "provide" unprotected oral to out compete their competition or command a higher hourly rate.

Providers want legalization so this type of activity is regulated. They don't want to feel pressured to perform an unsafe practice to compete in business. Legalizing prostitution would actually lower the rate of this pratice because it would ultimately create the networking that exists in other areas of the country. Don't get me wrong, all cities are highly networked within themselves and with other cities. It's just that some cities have a longer history of networking and have ultimately come to union-type standards. Providers everywhere stick together and support each other in many, many ways.

I hate hearing the double standard of the women must be diseased. When you consider that the population of hobbyists vastly outnumber the population of providers, it's rediculous to dump this all on the women of the community. Disease is a huge fear on both sides of the community; however, the hobbyists have a larger portion of participants that seem to feel they aren't at risk and push for unsafe practices.

This is a complex society filled with many intelligent people on both sides. The hobbyists are a vast selection of people from the top parts of our economic ladder. The average Joe (or John? -eyebrows raised-) couldn't afford to participate in this activity very often. Average rates start at $300 hour plus expenses for hotel rooms. The professions run the spectrum from lawyers, doctors, developers, airline pilots......the list is endless.

By the way, many providers are also professionals outside of the community. They hold full time jobs as nurses, accountants or whatever and provide on the side to supplement their income as single mothers or mothers that aren't receiving support payments from their divorced spouse. They chose providing over seeking government assitance or didn't qualify for government assistance but couldn't make ends meet. There are actually many that choose this profession because they enjoy it!

I'll return to post my arguments to why this profession should be legalized. I wanted to give you an overview of the community and also let you know that I've invited members of the community to participate on this thread. Some have read it and they were too upset to contribute. Out of respect to my wishes they control themselves, they told me they couldn't participate. However, others are planning to post and I hope you welcome their input and respect them as people when they do. As word gets through the grapevine, I have no idea who will show up on this thread as time goes on.

Please remember that this is a very diverse population, similar to the rest of the country. Please don't form opinions based on someone's communication skills or lifestyle. This thread has hurt some feelings and I hope you understand that when they come forth to discuss it. I would suggest approaching this topic as you would when you discuss African Americans and social issues -- with respect.

The issue of legalizing prostitution is embraced by the community and it's a very serious issue. However, the potential to achieve this is next to impossible because there isn't a platform available.

Tell them Libertarians embrace their cause.

My take on it is simple. Government should have no say in the private sexual life of consenting adults nor should they have a say in what one does with their own body.

*Applauding Eva*

I wasn't sure if I should bring up the labels "provider" and "hobbyist" since that seems to be a term among internet escorts. I am glad you broke the ice in that respect. There is a HUGE difference between the internets independant escort and the streetwalker. Most statistics are based on the streetwalkers. Most of those ladies are the ones who are way down on their luck, being exploited by men, and may practice unsafe sex simply because they don't give a sh** anymore.

All the providers I know (and I know quite a few personally) are not drug users, do not have pimps, practice safe sex only, and have personal integrity. They care about their job and the business. Most are well educated and those that don't have a college degree are not stupid.

Educate yourself, be informed, communicate. Do you have questions? Ask. Don't follow the stereotype or the reports and statistics that you read, written by people who don't even know providers. Ask the provider yourself. There are many out there who would love to dispell the myth.

B

First, I would like to say thanks to Eva for telling me about this place.

Second, so that you understand where I am coming from... and to break a few preconceived notions...

I am a provider. I prefer to call myself a courtesan because my job is not just about meeting a clients physical desires, there are emotional needs too. I have never used illegal drugs or abused legal ones. I have never been abused or molested. I practice safe sex. I have always been an independent lady (meaning no pimps or agencies). I am young, but not "Barbie" sized. And I tell almost everyone what I do. My family is spared.

I have taken notes over what has been said on this topic so that I could provide you with real information from someone who is part of this lifestyle.

Clients: My clients are not "gross men". They do not see me as an object. They are not losers. And quite a few of them are very attractive and do not really "need to pay".

They are men who are intelligent and kind. I am given gifts, lavished with attention and cherished. They respect my wishes and comply with my rules. They are safe and sane. They are lawyers, doctors, computer nerds , members of many Police Departments, members of Sheriff Offices, federal or city govenmental employees, Congressmen, Senators
Executives and a host of other professions.

STD's: Like I said above: I practice safe sex. My health is very important to me. I frequently read articles on STD's, etc. I visit with my Dr. (who knows what I do) regularly. I am young and fully expect to marry someone someday. I want children and a nice home. I have to LIVE long enough to get there... and I have to be "clean" so that my children and husband will be safe. My body is not for sale but my time is. However, in order to sell my time... I have to maintain my health.

I do not feel that there is rampant disease in our community. I find it much worse on high school and college level. Please make sure to inform your children about safe sex.

Age: I frequently find myself going up against the stereotype that "older women are better"!!! Go figure. Supposedly being over 30 in MY area is a bonus. There are very few of us youngins' who are praised as highly as the more "mature" ladies.

Jobs: I have found that getting a job is hard but unemployment is high. It's more than just "ladies" who are having trouble. My step-mother was out of a job for almost a year. She has found a job... and it's for much less than half of what she was making before. I can also add that many professionals have changed careers and become companions... by choice.

My views on Why I do what I do & How I feel:

I love my job. I have lots of free time to attend classes and go out. I like the men I spend TIME with. I get to choose who they are. I get to decide what I will or will not do with that person.

I get the pleasure of knowing that instead of seeking an affair (which has long term emotional implications) that they saw me... a professional; someone who can take care of their needs but doesn't bring emotional drama into their lives. For the span of an hour or (usually) more I relieve them from the stresses of the everyday world and pamper them. Massaging their cares away... feeding them bits of sweetened fruit... cuddling. Mostly I am just a very good listener. Someone they can talk to freely. I can offer independent advise.

I have... on occasion... spent time with couples. I have been asked by a few women. It's not just men who seek the pleasure of companionship.

When I read the words "demeaning" and "pathetic" they seemed to be said sneeringly. I do not appreciate you looking down on us. It is inappropriate to look down on anyone. Your preconceived notions are what you have been fed by the media and others. The views are not that of reality.

I assure you... there are a lot more girls who are companions than you will ever realize. Most of them are not on the streets. There are many who do not advertise at all. We are intelligent. You would never recognize us unless we told you what we do. It is a business for us... as legitimate as any other.

FAQ:

If someone is going to use drugs they will find the money they need to satisfy their desire in any way possible. Prostitution has nothing to do with it.

"Sex Industry" refers to all types of "sex work" (ie: peep shows, stripping, brothels, etc.)

The constitution does not prohibit "prostitution".

For Momof3... "Pimps" are illegal.

Points to ponder:

Taxes - I would pay them. Especially if I could get:
- Health Insurance
- Cheaper STD Testing
- Better and MORE Accurate Health Information!!
- More Security ie: Police protection, better access to information used in the screening process

Yes... some might still play outside the laws but every industry has it's problems.

No... I do not think there would be more "prostitutes".

Well... that's just about everything. Hope you've had fun reading.

O.

U.S. Supreme Court has ruled that the state cannot (with exceptions and age limits) regulate a woman's fertility and reproductive life.

Given that abortion is 2/3's legal (time frame) why shouldn't an adult woman (or a man, for that matter) be allowed to do with her/his body what they wish.

The Supremes have taken the government out of the bedroom. Why not the "Life."

Certianly, if driving, alcohol consumption, weapons can be regulated -- sensibly -- prostitution can be regulated the same way -- sensibly, and not just banned.

Banning something only makes it more sought after imho.

Glad to see some real Ladies and Clients are posting here.... ck ya later.

I am very glad to see that there are people who are actually in the industry that are posting. Thank you for sharing your thoughts on this subject. I hope that you will also peruse the rest of the forum and join us in some of the other debates.

I would like to know if you feel that legalizing prostitution would benefit the street walker in addition to the provider. Obviously, these two different levels need to be looked at a little bit differently, and I appreciate that you pointed that out.

Would streetwalkers benefit from legalized prostitution?

It depends on what type of system is created. If it's a system that supports the agency design, then I don't think a streetwalker would benefit from it too much. In my opinion, a legal agency allows potential to extort, even enslave. Of course, the intention of this type of legislation would be to have monitoring control of the providers but it would play out differently in reality.

Canada has legalized independent prostitution, not agencies, for this reason. It's obvious that if an independent is in the industry, she is doing so by her own free will. I believe it would be possible to still monitor independents through licensing.

Would society benefit from legalization as it pertains to streetwalker issues?

I don't think so. I believe even if prostitution is legalized, you will always have the unmonitored streetwalker. I'm sure many of you have read I'm very against drugs and I believe drugs are the route of the problem in the streetwalker's world.

It may slow the customer base for streetwalkers. Legalization would allow for more affordable competition for the guys looking for a bargain. I think the guys are better suited for addressing this line of thought though. Maybe hobbyist might be able to share some insight into the male perspective. (I'm not implying that they see streetwalkers but they probably know the attitude of other guys in the hobby better than I do.) Any guys willing to toss this idea around on here?

What's being done now?

The community has made some efforts to help streetwalkers and raise awareness throughout all levels of the community. Here's a link to one grass roots effort in Portland.

http://www.danzine.org/index.html

Now I have a question for all the political experts on this board.

How can we legalize prostitution?

We've tossed this issue around among the community endlessly. Since the community is comprised of providers and hobbyists that can't speak out publicly, it's impossible to gain support. Any politician would be committing political suicide if they embraced this issue.

The best I can tell is that a provider would have to fight it all the way to the Supreme Court. It's going to be a very long time before anyone decides to publicly try this route since it's much easier to just pay the fine and remain relatively anonymous.

Any ideas?



By the way, I'd like to thank Oly, Devereaux, and Mustang for participating on this thread along with the others that opted to support this issue by voting in the poll. This really is a great site. Look around, I'm sure you'll find other issues you feel passionate about.

I would honestly suggest voting Libertarian.

hugo was correct in stating

The Libertarians are the only party to actually address issues like this.

We need to tell the government that it needs to get out of our social lives. While I know there are other ways to get this ball rolling, your vote is a good start.

So what you are saying is that in all actuality, it would be more safe for a streetwalker to operate independently. What about potential violence from the clientele. We are, after all, talking about two very different class levels of prostitution, and the clientele is going to have the same differences. Do you not think that the agency set-up provides protection on that level? Which one presents a larger threat to the streetwalker: the client or the agency? I don't have any preconceived answers to these questions. I'm honestly asking, because you have provided some interesting viewpoints, and my personal experiences have been with male streetwalkers who were supporting a drug habit and who were operating independently and experienced physical abuse from their clients.



I'm going to second Jaime's suggestion regarding voting Libertarian. They have addressed the issue, and they support legalization.



I think that coming on this forum and talking about this is a good start. It provides both providers and hobbyists with some level of anonymity, but you are actively dispelling the myths that surround prostitution. Even if people disagree with your stance on the issue, they are learning something, and by discussing this with someone who is actually involved in the industry, it humanizes the people who are in the industry, if that makes any sense. It's easy to talk about people as though they are statistics if you aren't actually having interaction with the people involved, and it's also easy to take our experiences and limit our ideas based on those experiences. We can learn from each other.

These are tough questions to answer because I don't think a legalized agency setup would permit the agencies to put girls on the street. If the government chose this type of system, the government would prefer them to be in brothels instead of on the streets.

Let's assume for a moment that the government allowed streetwalkers on the street. The agency setup could possibly allow a "pimp" type personality to claim he is a legal business.

I'm sure the pimps aren't protecting the streetwalkers from being attacked by clients. They are making sure the girls go out there and produce. I think any streetwalker that is being "managed" by a pimp is in equal danger by her pimp and her clients. It's a darn shame we aren't going to be hearing from any streetwalkers on this forum.



This isn't entirely true. Some men also frequent streetwalkers.

The protection an independent has with their clients is that they have a screening process -- sorry I can't go into the details on here. This isn't the type of thing where someone comes without an appointment.

I think there will always be streetwalkers but legalization might allow some of them to get off the street and operate their business a different way.

Honestly, if we are merely looking for an answer to streetwalker dangers, I feel the root of the problem is drugs. That's what is driving these people to the streets to begin with. Maybe the runaways get put there first and then end up on drugs but I feel if you focus on the drug issue in addition to leagalization of prostitution, you'll have a better chance of resolving the streetwalker's issues.

A good question to ask is what really puts the streetwalkers at physical risk with the clients? Are they under the influence of a drug resulting in poor judgement? Or because they are actually on the streets and an easy target? I think both.

Another thing is it appears as if there is the assumption that if it's legalized by an agency design the streetwalkers will get off the streets and work inside an agency. However, if you'd like to assume they'd leave the streets to work in an agency, why would you not assume that they would leave the streets to work more like an independent by advertising, screening and scheduling appointments?

Someone could argue that the independents have the intelligence to accomplish this goal. It's possibly true that a streetwalker might not have the abilities to approach the business on her own in this manner. Therefore, agencies would be a good choice for them.

I'm not thrilled with the idea of agencies but I guess they could have their place if they were stictly monitored. Plus, guys like having places they can go without having to schedule an appointment two weeks in advance.

I just think it would be bad policy to only legalize agencies and not permit independent activity. I feel a girl has a right to work for herself and by her own rules. An agency wants a girl to have 4 billable hours per hour. If a girl wants to work a lighter workload, an agency isn't going to permit her to do so. By only having the option to work for an agency, it's putting women in a position where they HAVE to see a certain number of clients to be considered profitable to the agency. I feel a girl should have the choice to go out on her own so she can have less volume that she feels emotionally and physically comfortable participating in.



By the way, what are those other ways?

Excuuuuuuuuse me? That was me you quoted.

My apologies, Danya.

What if he/she was required to be licensed as were all of the ladies, and what if the ladies had a choice to either work in a brothel or work independently? Basically, set it up so that everyone who works in the industry has to be licensed, but the girls who work at the brothels would still be independent contractors who pay a portion of their commission, as defined by contract, to the brothel. The brothel, in return, provides certain services such as security, private rooms, clean bedding, etc. If the head of the brothel treats any of the girls/guys poorly, they would have recourse against the head of the brothel by contacting the licensing commission, and the head of the brothel would be in danger of having his/her license revoked permanently.

Girls/Guys who wanted to work independently could also do this, but they would still be required to have a license. This would allow the more business saavy girls to go out on their own, but it would also allow the girls who aren't as independent to work within the structure of a brothel.



My thought is that if prostitution were legalized, destigmatized, and organized properly, this particular version of a pimp would be pushed out of the scene at least for the most part.

I fully support this. I think I actually got around to this concept at the end of my post.

However, we need to be realistic. There will always be a percentage of streetwalkers -- this might help reduce streetwalkers but there will always be a segment of society that can't find transportation to an employer's site or isn't desirable as an employee that will choose to work the streets.

We also need to be aware that licensed agencies could "import" foreign women as slaves. I saw a documentary a long time ago on this -- the location of one such place discovered was on the outskirts of Las Vegas. This type of activity could possilbly increase with legalization. The profit margin on relatively free labor is the motivating factor for the people guilty of this terrible act.

We just need to go into this with our eyes open and have plans set in place to keep people from being mistreated.

This isn't going to happen very quickly. Many in the community are terrified of being outed. One hobbyist warned everyone to go to a public ISP computer if they are going to participate on this board. Also, regardless of anonymity, there is the fear of the widespread ramifications of too much public attention to the subject.

I think part of the problem with streetwalkers can be helped with education of the "john's". Scenario: Escorts would be required to have a license. A valid license would entail regular health checks and all that plus a valid street address to work from. This could be the escorts own apartment or a "brothel". Inform the gentlemen somehow that only licensed providers are legal and are regularly screened etc. Most men I know would prefer the licensed as opposed to the health and legal risk of the streetwalker, effectively cutting down on SW (streetwalker) business and increasing the business of the licensed providers. AND therefore encouraging the SW to become legit. Am I making any sense here?

B

Please rest assured Mike and I pride ourselves on the promise of privacy we make to our members upon registration. We will never share anyone's information. I empathize with the sentiment, however.


Is this only in respect to the fact the some of the proponents of this are in the industry and could get themselves in trouble? Or do you mean something on a wider scale? I'm unclear on this.

Eva, you also said
Well, besides the vote, there are the letters.

Mike and I are prolific letter writers. We write to everyone about everything. We have written to politicians, members of the media, corporations and individuals for a number of issues (I could bore you in a PM or another thread if you'd like details ). We get pretty good response most of the time.

Additionally, you could always push for your own local legislation. Intimidating, yes.

The approach(es) depends on how you want to fight it. <shrug>

______________________

Thank you to all of you "in the know" for voicing your opinions here and educating many of us. Please drop into some of the other debates

Yes, this absolutely makes sense.