Educationally, Arab nations rank extremely low in relation to the rest of the world.

Illiteracy rates in the beginning of the 21st century is well into 60 million adults with the majority being women.

expenditures in scientific research are among the lowest in the world. Arab nations lag behind technologically.

Books translated into Arabic is about 330 books annually, 1/5 of the number that greece translates.

In the digital divide, Arabs represent 5% of the world population yet only 0.5% of Internet users.

Political participation = less advanced in Arab world than other developing nations. Out of 7 world regions they had the lowest freedom score. Women's freedoms in this region equals the lowest evidenced by lack of women in govt and the work force in general.

Richer in natural resourses (oil) than any of the DEVELOPING nations, the Arab world is just as if not more underdeveloped. Clearly the Arab world exists only in development of the vast oil riches, and LESS in human development, as it is a region of the world that contributes little else to its people and globally...

WHY?.

Question:

1.Is Islam holding Arab Nations back, or is it something else entirely?

Wow. Unfortunately, I do see extreme Islam as a stumbling block for it's peoples advancement in the world community. Muslim women having to come to western nations for a good education because they can't get it in their homeland because of the religious laws imposed.

It is extremely important to remember that the individual "Arab" nations have been in existence for very short periods of time, and the states less so. It is a fallacy to compare and contrast them to Western Nations. There has been a Greek nation for over 2000 years.

Joe -

who is comparing them to the west?

The post clearly stated in comparison to other developing nations.

The Muslim treatment of women plays a big role here.

Since traditionally, Muslim women are not educated beyond the basics, they cannot develop into full members of society. The literacy scores of the population are low because of this.

The other facet here is the lack of investment in technology. It seems that these oil-rich companies are simply willing to outsource all of their higher education needs (How many foreign Middle East students do we have in American universities? How many Americans travel to the ME for higher education...?)

Sure, you can say that they are a developing country, but a developing country simply must make this investment in their own future.

Another downfall of the Middle East culture is its class divisions. If you aren't born wealthy, the chances are overwhelming that you will never become wealthy. How do they escape this situation? Those that can emigrate to the West. unfortunately, those that can are often the best thinkers and innovators, taking their ideas and ambitions with them to the West, leaving their homeland behind.

Greece is a developing nation economically, but as a nation they have been in existence for two thousand years. The nations of the Middle East (with the exception of Egypt) cannot claim the same. They have been conquered and reconquered, the people have been migratory and they had states imposed on arbitrary boundaries regardless of national geography.

That is not to say that Islam is not a factor, but we should remember that Islam was a source for cultural enlightenment and scientific exploration during the Dark Ages in Europe, and it is they who were largely responsible for the preservation of the cultural heritage of classical Greece and Rome.

Joe- you are missing the point entirely. this is a CURRENT problem with the Arab region. Try to go forward in time.

this study was made for Arabs by Arabs, and what the thread was based upon.

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/759...B1D73295B22.htm

there is a problem with policy within the Arab world. Clearly.


Amlord-
you're correct. Arab women are held back. They account for 1/2 the pop. and are basically an unused commodity. A great loss unfortunately.

Is the teachings and strict adherance of Islam oppression this and other involvement of the Arab population in both science and technology or is the oppression coming from without?

Joe,

I don't understand the Greece angle. What does that have to do with this debate?

I think it was the Byzantine Empire that preserved the Roman culture. The Byzantines (Eastern Roman Empire) were conquered by the Muslims, but I don't recall them preserving the history of Rome (other than maybe Constantinople itself).

But what does all that have to do with the current situation in the Arab world?

It could be Islam or it could be the fact that most arab nations are Isolationists. Isolationists tend to stem away from advancement and prefer to stay in the past.

Also, it could be the mass poverty in arab nations that cause this and also the hate towards Western technologies such as computers because they may precieve them as "Western Propaganda tools". Also, the internet users are limited in the arab world because some Islamic hardliners don't want muslims to see the truth of the West and prefer to make them think we are evil

SoCaliente_1

Did you get this from the latest Freidman article?

It was also pointed out in that article that something like 35% of those who receive a university degree leave the country in pursuit of a better life...35%! What a huge brain drain.

I am interested to know what countries this was compared to? I mean ZA is in an awful mess too.

I think it just has to do with the structure of Gov personally...what opportunities are available to you if you are not born the son of a prince? Or to a family that has political ties.

Not all Arab nations are a mess tho...my friend lives in UAE and it is gorgeous she says...very clean beautiful city...has the big tech school there. Also has the world's most luxurious hotel and a massive shopping mall...Dubai is a big tourist (or I maybe I should say was) attraction.

bucket -

I think it is too much to declare the middle East a failed nation compared to developing nations. Sure they have work to go but the Middle East has some powerful countries.

Kuwait is wealthy and bringing in some reforms.
Saudi Arabia has wealth at the top.
Jordan seems to have been a fairly stable nation and is bringing democratic reforms.
Egypt was able to work itself out of its endless cycle of violence with Israel.

These nations compare favorably with African nations and many Asian nations.

Greece BTW has not been a nation for thousands of years, it reemerged from the Ottoman empire in the 19th century.

Well I hope this is not considered too off topic..but someone has already brought about the idea that this is how it is possibly because of Islam.

Bush just granted a little over a 150 millions dollars to Indonesia for their education.


source

Also I just read a report about Afghanistan and apperently the girl's school have repetitively been targets for attacks from Taliban supporters and some families are now too frightened to send their daughters anymore.

Historically, this is difficult to support. The Islamic world was the center of cultural and scientific advances for centuries. Notably, this came about because their permissiveness and acceptance of other societies and religions enticed scholars and artisans from around the world. Exactly the opposite has occurred during the relatively recent downturn of the Islamic states, esp. in the Middle East. However, Islam was present during both episodes, so could be ruled out as the cause of the current situation.

In short; Yes... I mean No!

I see Islam as much the same sort of paralysing ideology as communism, where by the faithful are encouraged to put their brains in neutral, and simply accept the word of Allah, as interpreted by the experts (commisars or priests, whats the difference?)

But Is ee the real problem as one of a culture which allows its religon to dominate its opinions.

By itself, I don't think Islam matters too much, except for the fact that we human beings like cheat.

We cheat on each other, on our partners (I'm speaking in general, and not refering to myself ) and we cheat on God.

So when the Muslim's cry out against the west, they fail utterly to take into account the Toyota land cruiser they drove to the mosque in, the satelites which beam down their Arabic TV channels (the AK 74's slung over their shoulders?), and the expensive hospital with its specialized medical equipment which saves their lives when they have a heart attack, and concentrate only on the western influences they cannot control or use.

In short, they are hypocrites of the first order.

editted to claify

Hobbes I do not support the idea that Islam is at fault. Others seemed to be leaning that way tho. Just explaining why I was bringing in info about Indonesia in a debate on Arab nations.

Obviously Bush feels education is a key factor, and he must also feel that Islam is not at fault either as the educational grant is intended for Islamic schools too.

centuries ago were just that. centuries ago.

Saudi Arabia funds private Madrassas which teach only the Wahabbistic form of Islam in Pakistan and little else in the way of science and technology. Graduates of these private Madrassas schools are skill-less in understanding the modern world around them. they are at a loss to develop.

Public education finds itself in a far worse situation.



Again, only males may attend these schools btw. That alone would suggest Islam's hand wouldn't it? It is hard to discount the negative influences Islam has on advancements of Arab women and Arab men in terms of education in THIS century.

That's why the literacy and basic knowledge of things are gone from Arab society. Because nutballs like the Taliban don't want certain types of people learn. So, they either burn the school to the ground or they threaten lives by banishing females to their homes. It's sickening that some people treat human beings like this. Keeping them from learning about the world around them and from learning at all is inhumane in it's self. That is why the Arab world is the most frowned on and the most uneducated.

Improvements must be made.


Eeyore:

As much as i would like to agree with you on the points you raised here:



I would have to say that Kuwait is the only arab nation in the whole region we can consider an honest friend and well off nation. Kuwait has the highest educated in the Arab world and that is almost democratic if it weren't for a few things. Jordon would be second. Jordon's reforms are commendible but still has far to go. As for the other 2....no comment.