Full Version: The 10 "Commandments"
As I've said before, I think this is the biggest hole in the Bible.
Whatever "God" wants IS. If "God" wished for something to be SO BAD that he would COMMAND it then why wouldn't it just be?
"God" NEVER commanded anything.
"The "path" to "God" is realized when you see these changes in you" is what was supposed to be "heard". "God" never "said" anything that resembles "I command this of you or else". The "Commandments" are commitments or more like lightposts on a trail.
The 1st:
You will love "God" with you heart, mind and soul. There will be no "God" put before "me" (ie. human love, money, power). You shall set these things aside for you will have outgrown them.
2nd:
You'll understand the power carried with thought & words and shall not use the name of "God" in vain. The Great "I AM" can never be used in vain.
3rd:
So that you do not stay too long in you illusion you shall keep "holy" a day for "me". You willl eventually take every moment as "holy".
4th:
You'll know you are a "child" of "God" when you honor your mother and father in all you say, think & do. So too you will honor everyone.
5th:
Your new reverence for life will bring you honor for all forms of life. You will impact them only when it is for the highest of good.
6th:
I promise you that when you find "God' you will not defile love's purity with deceit.
7th:
You'll take nothing that is not your own. You will not desire to connive or harm another to attain anything.
8th:
Never will you say a thing that is not true & thus bear false witness.
The 9th is really difficult. I don't know how to say this one. When I find a way to put it into words I'll edit this post but at the moment I just don't understand how to explain it. the 10th is similar but it speaks of posessions and not other souls or beings.
10th:
You will know that all goods can be yours and that all of your goods belong to the world. You will have no desire to covet another's possesions.
These are your freedoms, see them not as restrictions. "God" does not order about what "God" created. "God" merely tells "children" that this is how you will know you are comming "home".
Scramble the Bible pounders...
Whatever "God" wants IS. If "God" wished for something to be SO BAD that he would COMMAND it then why wouldn't it just be?
"God" NEVER commanded anything.
"The "path" to "God" is realized when you see these changes in you" is what was supposed to be "heard". "God" never "said" anything that resembles "I command this of you or else". The "Commandments" are commitments or more like lightposts on a trail.
The 1st:
You will love "God" with you heart, mind and soul. There will be no "God" put before "me" (ie. human love, money, power). You shall set these things aside for you will have outgrown them.
2nd:
You'll understand the power carried with thought & words and shall not use the name of "God" in vain. The Great "I AM" can never be used in vain.
3rd:
So that you do not stay too long in you illusion you shall keep "holy" a day for "me". You willl eventually take every moment as "holy".
4th:
You'll know you are a "child" of "God" when you honor your mother and father in all you say, think & do. So too you will honor everyone.
5th:
Your new reverence for life will bring you honor for all forms of life. You will impact them only when it is for the highest of good.
6th:
I promise you that when you find "God' you will not defile love's purity with deceit.
7th:
You'll take nothing that is not your own. You will not desire to connive or harm another to attain anything.
8th:
Never will you say a thing that is not true & thus bear false witness.
The 9th is really difficult. I don't know how to say this one. When I find a way to put it into words I'll edit this post but at the moment I just don't understand how to explain it. the 10th is similar but it speaks of posessions and not other souls or beings.
10th:
You will know that all goods can be yours and that all of your goods belong to the world. You will have no desire to covet another's possesions.
These are your freedoms, see them not as restrictions. "God" does not order about what "God" created. "God" merely tells "children" that this is how you will know you are comming "home".
Scramble the Bible pounders...
Whoops, almost let this one get past me... 
What's funny here is that half of your argument doesn't even oppose the Bible. For example 1st John says
2:2-5
and he -- he is a propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only, but also for the whole world, and in this we know that we have known him, if his commands we may keep; he who is saying, `I have known him,' and his command is not keeping, a liar he is, and in him the truth is not;
and whoever may keep his word, truly in him the love of God hath been perfected; in this we know that in him we are.
Pardon the translation (Youngs Literal, very accurate but the syntax is strange)
To put it shortly the when you see that you are following the Ten Commandments, then you know that you are saved. This is because those who are save WANT to follow what God says therefore they seek out the Ten Commandments.
In short your argument in in line with what the Bible says, so no flaw there...
What's funny here is that half of your argument doesn't even oppose the Bible. For example 1st John says
2:2-5
and he -- he is a propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only, but also for the whole world, and in this we know that we have known him, if his commands we may keep; he who is saying, `I have known him,' and his command is not keeping, a liar he is, and in him the truth is not;
and whoever may keep his word, truly in him the love of God hath been perfected; in this we know that in him we are.
Pardon the translation (Youngs Literal, very accurate but the syntax is strange)
To put it shortly the when you see that you are following the Ten Commandments, then you know that you are saved. This is because those who are save WANT to follow what God says therefore they seek out the Ten Commandments.
In short your argument in in line with what the Bible says, so no flaw there...
Concerning the other half of your argument (God doesn't command anything). Umm... close. God doesn't have to command anything. However, is it so incomprehesible to believe that God would let people come to him willingly by laying out his law? What God wants can be if he chooses to make it so. This doesn't mean he will always make that choice.
Of course "my version" of the "Commandments" don't contradict the Bible.
They're the "word" of "God".
Again, I know that "God" never COMMANDS anything of us because "God" "told" me so and not because "it so incomprehesible to believe that God would let people come to him willingly by laying out his law". "God" has no laws, "God" makes no commands.
They're lightposts on the trail, not fences or walls.
They're the "word" of "God".
Again, I know that "God" never COMMANDS anything of us because "God" "told" me so and not because "it so incomprehesible to believe that God would let people come to him willingly by laying out his law". "God" has no laws, "God" makes no commands.
They're lightposts on the trail, not fences or walls.
QUOTE(Roy @ Nov 5 2002, 11:33 PM)
2nd:
You'll understand the power carried with thought & words and shall not use the name of "God" in vain. The Great "I AM" can never be used in vain.
You'll understand the power carried with thought & words and shall not use the name of "God" in vain. The Great "I AM" can never be used in vain.
This one I don't quite understand. The word "God" should not be used in vain?
QUOTE
Never will you say a thing that is not true & thus bear false witness.
This one assumes that when a person reaches the desired spiritual state, that he/she would never lie. Does this include little white lies? Children eventually learn that white lies protect people from insulting each other.
"Don't you love this song?"
"Yea."
I never met anyone who never lies a little - does that mean that I have never met anyone who has reached this spiritual state?
I like your interpretations, but this one may need a little refining...
jjirout
I believe it is all about choice, although this is only my opinion.
You see, if you are saved, and begin to follow the covenant in life, then you have chosen to be with God, and this is eternal. If you do not, then you have chosen separation from God, which is also eternal. Separation from God, referred to as "hell," is not a punishment brought on by a vengeful god, it is a choice one makes through his or her life.
jjirout:
The commandment states that one should not bear false witness against one's neighbor. Therefore, it is possible that only lies told with the intent to cause pain are warned against. I am not sure of this, however.
You see, if you are saved, and begin to follow the covenant in life, then you have chosen to be with God, and this is eternal. If you do not, then you have chosen separation from God, which is also eternal. Separation from God, referred to as "hell," is not a punishment brought on by a vengeful god, it is a choice one makes through his or her life.
jjirout:
The commandment states that one should not bear false witness against one's neighbor. Therefore, it is possible that only lies told with the intent to cause pain are warned against. I am not sure of this, however.
QUOTE(Shild @ Nov 15 2002, 04:45 PM)
You see, if you are saved, and begin to follow the covenant in life, then you have chosen to be with God, and this is eternal. If you do not, then you have chosen separation from God, which is also eternal. Separation from God, referred to as "hell," is not a punishment brought on by a vengeful god, it is a choice one makes through his or her life.
Shild, in case you care, I think statements like that which you made above, is what scares off many non-Christians and even makes some non-Christians resent Christians.
I have always had trouble believing that a devout Buddist or Hindi will go to hell because they have not been "saved."
I know you qualified your statement by saying it was only your opinion, Shild, and I appreciate that. I think that makes you a marvelous debater. Thank you for presenting your views without condemning any of us agnostics and non-believers.
_____
On that same note, and perhaps I should start a new thread, I've always been curious why god would ever think us in need of "saving." What does that even mean, really? I honestly don't know. I'd appreciate everyone's thoughts.
QUOTE(Jaime @ Nov 15 2002, 05:13 PM)
_____
On that same note, and perhaps I should start a new thread, I've always been curious why god would ever think us in need of "saving." What does that even mean, really? I honestly don't know. I'd appreciate everyone's thoughts.
Personally, I think that "saving" means feeling some joy in life - and consequently valuing your own life and life in general. I don't believe people who are "saved" necessarily follow a list of right and wrongs - that they are ... not bumblingly happy, but maybe ... a little inspired at times...
Maybe I should send this stuff to hallmark.
jjirout
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