LUCASVILLE - Four prison guards carried a tearful and unwilling Lewis Williams Jr. into an execution chamber Wednesday morning as the Cleveland man begged for divine intervention to spare his life.

As the prison crew strapped Williams onto a padded metal gurney, he cried out: "I'm not guilty, I'm not guilty. God, please help me. I didn't commit these crimes."

After 21 years on death row, Williams, 45, died by lethal injection just after 10 a.m. at the Lucasville prison. A grim drama played out as Williams - convicted of killing 76-year-old Leoma Chmielewski in Cleveland on Jan. 20, 1983 - struggled with guards and lamented his fate until the end.

Fifteen minutes before the execution, Williams struggled with guards in a nearby preparation room. As the guards tried to lift Williams onto a bed, he fell to his knees and grasped the bed's edge.

At least eight guards had to hold the 5-foot 3-inch, balding man down so other staffers could swab and ready his arms for intravenous tubes. Williams winced and yelled throughout the process.

http://www.cleveland.com/cuyahoga/plaindea...62702204262.xml

I'm not sure what appalls me most. The fact that the wheels of justice turned so slowly that it took 21 years to put a murderer to death, how ugly a scene it must have been to watch a 5-foot-3 inch, 117 pound man fighting eight men for his life, or the whole finality of the death penalty.

The Supreme Court has already settled the issue as to whether or not the death penalty is cruel and unusual, so that isn't the question for debate. Let's make it a bit more personal shall we?

Hypothetical situation: You've been convicted of first-degree murder. Your guilt has been proven in a court of law, you received a fair trial and all your appeals have been exhausted. You're going to die at midnight by lethal injection.

Would you go to your death stoically, resigned to your fate and not reveal any emotion OR would you go kicking and screaming, bitterly protesting your innocence and fighting to the bitter end?

Yuck question.

After all that time with appeals and trials, I'd probably be stoic about it. I would have died inside long before that anyway.

Difficult answer.

If I were innocent and facing the needle, I'd probably do the same. Somehow, I just don't see people who have the capacity to kill someone caring one way or the other.

On the other hand, he could be lying and using it as a tactic. Unfortunately, I think we have to ignore that. We can't allow begging for mercy to work. Where are his lawyers jumping up and down about this? How come they're not on the news talking with the talking heads about how wrong it is? Meaning, if I were his lawyer and knew an innocent man was being executed, nobody would know the inmate freaked out because I'd be freaking out more.

Which is why I hate the death penalty to begin with. Although I'm totally in favor of capital punishment as a premise, I'm totally against it's implementation. I could never trust the word of a lawyer to be totally truthful, but we have an entire roomful of them deciding on a man's life.

I feel bad for the guy because I don't know the truth. Unfortunatly, it's possible nobody else does either.

For me, it would really depend on whether I committed the murder or not. If I felt I deserved it, I would make my peace with the Deity and the family of the victim, and be stoic about it, I think. Who really knows until it happens?

If I were innocent, I might struggle as much as this guy did. Or I might make a little speech about how unfair the system is.

But whether I went stoically or noisily, would it make any difference to anyone besides me?

(Edited to say: Why do they swab the arms of the condemned before they insert the needles when they know he is not going to be around to get an infection???)

Kicking and screaming. Biting and clawing. gouging and gnawing.
although amf has an point after that much time being locked up I might have already hung myself.

After all available legal channels have been exhausted by both my attorney and my efforts during the period of 21 years (deplorable amount of time to be sitting on death row!), I would hopefully be resigned to my fate. I would make peace with my maker, extend my apology to the victim's family, and face the final justice walking with my head up and my mouth shut and at peace knowing that where I am going will be a whole lot better than where I am coming from!

I am a coward, so I know I will go out screaming. (The fact that I am so timid is also one reason why I am very unlikely to kill anybody.)

I would go quietly and uneventfully.

This inmate would have done the same if they hadn't just put closed circuit TVs up for the ACLU to view. He wanted to give them a show...and he did.

Oh yes, obviously he was doing all this as a show for the ACLU. That's his only possible motivation.

Something makes me think that, in the face of death, this man was slightly beyond a devious liberal political ploy. I'm not saying he was telling the truth, because I don't know - unlike your conclusions, I cannot claim omnipotence in this case...

As for the question - It depends how long I was on death row. Even if I actually was innocent, after 20+ years I would probably go quietly - perhaps try to smile at the guards, tell them, "it's ok," or, "I forgive you."

On the other hand, if my execution was only a couple of months after my wrongful conviction, I probably would go kicking and screaming, as much as I might wish otherwise.

Okay, I've argued my point of view on several other threads. If I have been sentenced to death, it is obvious that I didn't argue effectively enough. I would likely try to cheat the hangman of his penny.

Being a diabetic, one of my favorite recollections was of a diabetic on death row who requested a 5 pound box of chocolates as his last meal. It was enough sugar, that he died before he was scheduled to be executed. If I had to swallow my cup of hemlock, that sort of an end run would appeal to me. But then, I once tried suicide by banana splits...

What an awful thought.



Neither, I would cry the whole way...

I just wonder about 76 year old Leoma Chmielewski.. if she knew she was going to be murdered, what do you think her reaction would have been?

..Sigh..

Why do we focus so much on the plight of the criminal instead of that of the victim?

Would you go to your death stoically, resigned to your fate and not reveal any emotion OR would you go kicking and screaming, bitterly protesting your innocence and fighting to the bitter end?

Since I would be a peace with my Maker and would have had spiritual counseling and knowing that it was an injection, putting me "to sleep" painlessly, I would go quietly and cooperate. There's a better place waiting for me.

Only because of the questions posed.

Since nighttimer asked that we don't make this an argument about the death penalty, I haven't. But in the event that I were the condemned prisoner and I had not committed the crime, I would not "go quietly into that good night;" I would rail against a justice system that screws up periodically, regardless of my faith in reaching that good eternal destination.

If I was truly innocent and had used every avenue to try and exonerate myself and it still didn't work, what would be the point of fighting on the way down the hall to be executed? I would want my last few moments on this earth to be as peaceful as possible. I would want to keep my dignity, regardless of the circumstances.

You're right, Billy Jean, dignity is important.

Maybe I wouldn't kick, scream or beg, but I still think the angry humanity in me would demand that I let the world know I was majorly p.o.'ed.

Yeah, I understand, and under pressure and fear of my own mortality, I would probably freak out too, it would be hard not too. It would make me appreciate the true sacrifice another innocent man made 2000 years ago and the manor in which He handled His accusers...

It's hard to place myself in this position. But, knowing me, I would be so upset, my cries might sound like howls. They'd have to carry me in, because I don't think I could walk.

To answer my own own question, i think the macho part of me says I'd go out doing my best Clint Eastwood impression and trying to play it cool and hardcore.

"Screw it--you can kill me, but I ain't goin' out like some punk."

Then again, everyone wants to go to heaven, but nobody wants to die. I'm afraid that I might not be so brave and just maybe I would blubber like a big sissy. Who cares about dignity when you're about to get put down like a unwanted mutt?

I think in my mind's eye I would come off far more manly than I might if I wound up in such a unpleasant situation.

This worries me because he might well have been innocent.
On two counts I wonder about this,
21 years ago? Forensics have gotten much better now, not to mention DNA testing. Also, I have looked at some cases of jury convictions that I think the juries convicted with extreme prejudice and with quite a bit of reasonable doubt. (HBO did a special on the West Memphis 3 (ark), where it appeared the juries convicted based on belief that the killings were satanic ritual because one of these kids dressed in black, practiced Wicca and listened to certain kinds of music (Metallica) in a community that considered this weird. Appeals were judged by the same judge as the original trial and went nowhere. One of the boys was sentanced to death and the other to life inprisonment.) This case has holes in it you could drive a bus through, yet, they are having a hard time getting funds for DNA testing, which is not available to them from the state.

Secondly, if you had really done it and sat on it for 21 years, would you really go out professing innocence, just to make a show? Maybe. Now Im interested in the details of this case.
Edited to add: I find little about the original case, but that he tried to claim mental retardation this year and his execution was temporarily stayed for evaluation, and he was found mentally sound. There is nothing on sites to suggest his trial was unfair, so my bad on this one.


How would I go? Id probably cry until near the end, where Id try to compose and THINK for the very last time.

This is a very sad story.

You do know that the ACLU had received complaints about the way executions were carried out in this facility, and they demanded a closed-circuit TV broadcast of all future executions, and this was the 1st execution to be broadcast by the prison and watched by the ACLU?

You don't think an inmate would want to get back at the system by making them look bad on their television debut?

I do.

The death penalty is an utter disgrace and a huge stain on the American canvas of society.

If I were convicted from day one I would be kicking and screaming making life hell for the guards. I would do anything in my power to stop it - including killing people to get out. I canot imagine the emotion of knowing you are innocent a being sentenced to death - it must be the worst human emotion possible.

I would bite, spit, swear, headbutt and I would want it shown in primary schools. Killing is wrong, whoever commits it regardless of the motivation. This scenes should be shown more, to people who havent seen or heard about them, to whip up enough support to ban this disgusting, institutionalised form of murder.

As long as America has the death penalty it is not a civilised country.

Let me get this straight...


Then you follow with:


Finally:


Excuse me, as much as I despise the current implementation of the death penalty, who is uncivilized?

First, though I dont want this to go off topic I better clear up my position. Please do not think you have exposed an inherent contradiction in my post I failed to notice. I did it on purpose to show the strength of my belief. I would engage in the worst sin to fight against it. We killed to defend ourselevs against a wider evil against Nazi Germany. This is the same except its on a individual basis.

Killing is totally wrong, if I was on death row it would be under self defence - the only legitmate reason for killing.



You are. By accepting the death penalty you are supporting an exceptionlly coercive measure of control. One which is usually only found in less developed countries. Like the Middle East and China.

Why is self defense a legitimate reason for killing? Because the law of the land has decided it should be a legal defense. The same law of the land that reinstated the death penalty as constitutional. The same law of the land that would have sentenced you (hypothetically) to execution. I am sympathetic with an anti-DP stance, but I doubt you'll win many supporters with the idea of killing to get out of the death penalty.

Let's take your hypothetical one step further. You are about to be executed. You try (as you mentioned) to escape and attempt to kill the guards. One of the guards is able to stop you by shooting you in the head. Was he justified in killing you because of self defense?

The concept of killing being justified in the case of self defense goes back at least as far as the Judeo-Christian Bible. In that hypothetical situation, the guard would be justified in putting a person down if it meant that his own life would otherwise be forfeit.

Alas, what a pity that situation would be. No pompous ceremony of having a guy beg for mercy for the gratification of a vengeful audience. No needless repetition of the crime and the prescribed "remedy" for the crime delivered in sepulchural tones. No strapping down the prisoner who could more easily and less expensively be blown away with a bullet like they do in China. No swabbing an arm with alcohol above a vein to prevent infection in a body that is mere minutes away from expiring. No final intervention of a physician who is violating his Hippocratic oath by administering the lethal chemicals. No exalted feelings of self-importance in the players. No satisfaction guaranteed to the gallery.

Aw gee, the poor little play ruined because someone wasn't ready to die. All the red licked off somebody's lollipop...

Yes he would be correct, he would be fulfiling his own self protection. What it does show, more than anythin else, is that introducing the death penalty raises the stakes - To get out I would have to take drastic action. If I was just in ordinary prison, there would be legal ways to prove my innocence.

What a sorry situation it would be though, me dying - my parents and friends being sad - and the guard dying - his family also being sad. All in the name of "justice" - No pro-penalty people have actually explicitly outlined why this is "justice."

How do you figure that? Death row inmates have just as much access to judicial appeal as regular inmates, plus the assistance of the various anti-death penalty advocacy groups.
There's a reason it takes up to 20 years in some cases to carry out the penalty.

Of course this is true, but at some point there is a point of no return - then what do you do?

Then you do what the law tells you to do.

If a person incarcerated for robbery feels his sentence his too long, what shall he do?

(1) appeal his conviction through the proper legal channels (while he is serving his time); or

(2) serve the time he feels is appropriate, and then attempt to break out of prison.


Society can't have prisoners dictating their own sentences. The purpose of their rights to appeal is to analyze any possible factual or legal errors at their trials. Simply because a prisoner feels his sentence is unfair does not justify an escape or (still stunned that you would say this) a murder.

I doubt very much that many murderers feel they deserve death. I also doubt that many other incarcerated subjects feel they deserve the sentences they received. But this is moot. Society has deemed the sentence to be inappropriate. Society has deemed the death penalty to be an appropriate sanction when there are certain aggravating factors present. If you disagree with this, take it up through the appropriate channel (the legal system).

You would think they could have hit him a couple times in the head with a billy club to stop all his nonsense.

For my own morbid two bits:

I may seem macabre, but I have never been afraid of my own death, so I doubt I would make much of a fit if I was going to be executed. I will assume that I am guilty of whatever they charged me of, and that being the case, I would probably push for a speedy execution, none of this 21 years sitting around being a burden on the rest of society.

If I was innocent, then I would probably try to use various appeals and such throughout my time in death row. But at the point of execution, I think I would only say “Hoka Hey” and go peacefully, if possible, with a smile and a joke, but I doubt I would be that calm. I will most likely go with a somber attitude, because its hard to think of good jokes when you think your about to die. (at least it is for me)

Hoka Hey is a expression I learned from the Blackfoot people while I was in Montana, it means: It’s a Good Day To Die, I have lived my life to its fullest today, and I have no regrets that I have not faced.



Quane

Why is it that everyone puts so much respect and trust into the State? Why is it the highest authority? Are we, its people not the highest authority? Laws were originally conceived to keep the population under control not for our own benefit. The state didnt care if a peasant killed another peasant in 18th century England, but were concerned with those who wanted reform, but them the reformists were seen as criminals. William Pitt consequently executed the major leaders of the movement: Holcroft; Horne Tooke;Thelwall - Were those for everyone's "protection".

How does the state make laws to protect us, when it clearly has no regard for human rights? It clearly doenst belive in them, why else do we consistently breach them all over the world? They want peace at home, so that they can maintain power - they are not concerned if the world is war ridden - why else do they support terrible regimes and supress democratic movements?

At the very time the American State was making and changing "wonderful laws" to protect us, they were brutally slaughtering the Indian people - this "protection" obviously didnt extend to them did it? The "protection" obviously applies only to the American population - That is the immigrant settlers.

For me to respect Law, as a postive, legitimate force, the western government have to respect the people of the world, which they are a long way from doing.

Let me propose an theretical analogy to you.

Reagan did a number of atrocious things in his two terms. He supported Pinochet in his first term and he lead a war against Nicaragua without good reason and many more. If I were a Nicaraguan, would I be "right" to kill Reagan in my own self defence, if he was at war against me(without good reason) would I not be fighting an "Evil" as we did against Nazi Germany?

The point is this: laws and what is definedas right and wrong are defined by the powerful in international politics, and the same is true for domestic issues. They are bent and twisted to suit poltical ends. How can there be a set of "laws" for our countries, and then a blatant disregard for the laws of other countries, and of international law itself? America expect their people to abide by the law, and if we commit an crime serious enough they will kill us. If America ignore International law and commit a terrible crime, should someone in the administration be held accountable and executed as well?

In the Nuremburg trials Goering raised an intersting point:

"The Victor will always be the judge and the vanquished the Accused"

The state has one primary function to protect its' citizens from aggressors from within and without. The death penalty makes sure one internal aggressor does not re-offend. The Indians government did a miserable job of protecting them from outside aggressors. They shared the typical fate of hunter-gatherers who came into contact with agrarians. That's the breaks.

What evidence can you supply for this assumption?

Dead people can't intentionally kill others. I thought that did not need to be said.

I agree completely PE. The whole episode is a badge of shame and makes a mockery of civilised justice.

If I were in this man's shoes, then it could only be because I was wrongly accused. I will never kill any one unless it be in self defence, and certainly not a 76 year old woman!

In that case I think I would have killed myself before being taken into the death cell. It would be far better to die by my own hand than be murdered by uncaring strangers to satisfy the cold empty feeling of revenge for the benefit of people who are more interested in seeing a man die than in finding the real killer.

I would go as calm and quiet as possible. No reason to kick and scream at that point, it's not helping anything.

BTW, I thought we weren't going to let this turn into a debate over the death penalty?!? Seems like that doesn't really belong in 'Casual Conversation' to me.

From www.clarkprosecutor.com



The ole fighting with the dog excuse.