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Ultimatejoe
I know that you're all following this closely, so this comes as no surprise, but Canada is having a national election today. tongue.gif

This year's election is perhaps the most heated in the last 16-20 years, with intense issues and even more intense rhetoric, with one candidate for the position of Prime Minister even accusing another of supporting child pornography. Here's an excellent recap of the past 36 days (the length of the campaign):

It wasn't so bad really

So, my question is, what impact if any do you see this election having on the United States. One party has openly declared support for the U.S. Missle Shield, while another has openly campaigned against it. One would institute massive tax-cuts that would actually make Canada a cheaper country (tax-wise) to live and work in that the U.S., while the other three major parties would keep tax rates stable.

Lastly, and more importantly, do you see any parallels or implications for the U.S. political sphere? In the past the two countries have followed one another through swings in political ideology (Trudeau then Carter, Reagan then Mulroney, etc.); and with the strongest right-wing candidate in years, and a plethora of new left-wing options available, a trend could be set today.
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carlitoswhey
I hope that the conservatives win. Canadians deserve a missle shield, now that the liberals have completely bankrupted their military. Stop the wussification of a great nation!

http://www.falange.us/canada.htm
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"The average age of the equipment in the Canadian Forces is over 20 years and it hasn't been well-maintained."

The Liberal government reduced defence spending by 23% and cut the number of regular military personnel to approximately 60,000 from 80,000 between 1993 and 2000. There were 120,000 people in the Canadian military in 1958.

There are now literally more women in the US air force than there are people in the Canadian military.
On the tax side, as someone who tries to sell my products and make money in Canada, the government does absolutely everything that they can to prevent my making a profit. Lower taxes and incentives to earn would boost not only American business, but native Canadian business as well.
Julian
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There are now literally more women in the US air force than there are people in the Canadian military.


What does that prove? - There are more women in the USA than there are people in Canada. Is this a reason for Canadians to start a mass breeding programme?
Vermillion
The last thing we need is to turn more into the US.

Don't get me wrong, Americans are justifiably proud about much of their country, and it suits them just fine. Whenever us Canadians suggest you might want to be more socially responsable or limit firearms or whatever, the common answer is "We are not Canadians, we have our own identity" and so on. It is a good answer.

But the opposite is also true. We are not Americans, and dont really wish to become more like Americans. The difference of course, is that we do not have agencies, political bodies and industries actively trying to change the US: The US does have these things trying to change Canada.

One of the biggest opponents of our Health care system is US private health and insurance companies. The NRA has wings in Canada. Lobbyists from the US are constantly trying to get us to change Canadian content laws so that they can have greater access to taking over domestic industries and airwaves.

The conservatives are actually the Reform party, who wish to be more like the US. I admire many things about the US, and am glad to have you as a neighbour, but don't want to be any more like you thanks...

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I hope that the conservatives win.  Canadians deserve a missle shield, now that the liberals have completely bankrupted their military.  Stop the wussification of a great nation!


We do not 'deserve' a missile shield, in particular one that does not work. We do not wish to be closer associated with the US military. Our nation has a small military, and we have since the CONSERVATIVES under Mulroney gutted it. Oh, and having a limited military does not equal 'wussification' thanks.

Oh, and by the way, speaking of wussification, try and imagine how fast I would get a Mod warning if I blatantly insulted the country of the US like you just did my country...
carlitoswhey
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Vermillion
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carlitoswhey
I hope that the conservatives win.  Canadians deserve a missle shield, now that the liberals have completely bankrupted their military.  Stop the wussification of a great nation!


We do not 'deserve' a missile shield, in particular one that does not work. We do not wish to be closer associated with the US military. Our nation has a small military, and we have since the CONSERVATIVES under Mulroney gutted it. Oh, and having a limited military does not equal 'wussification' thanks.

Oh, and by the way, speaking of wussification, try and imagine how fast I would get a Mod warning if I blatantly insulted the country of the US like you just did my country...
My second canadian apology of the day - I'm taking a few days off after this. I was referring specifically to policies and their (skewed through my American lens) effect on Canadian military strength. A big giant plank in Harper's platform was to strengthen the military, which in his words
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“Canadians are proud of our troops,” said Harper.  “But they’re embarrassed by the Liberals’ sinking subs, crashing choppers, green uniforms and their heavy reliance on the Americans for such basic tasks as long-range troop transport.” 

and the fact that Canada spends less money on defence than all NATO members save Luxembourg, which is just an easier to read version of my women-in-the-air-force comparison. A colourful way to make a point, comparing the size of things.

Surely you'll agree that there are plenty of Canadians that disagree with you and wouldn't mind becoming a bit more US-like in their gov't structure. Like the ones that come here for health care, or to star in our movies and TV biggrin.gif
Robert1
I would hope there will be no effect , Canada is a very peaceful country ,From what I have leaned from relatives in sherbrooke they work hard and play hard. There not out to bully or police the world ,they have no need for a defence shield , that shield would be for the USA really anyways not so much to protect Canada. I would hate to see Canada lose some of its freedoms by coming under our wing. Besides the fact bush pushed Canada back and opened his arms to Mexico. As far as Canadas military ,they chose healthcare instead . Did you know in the 50s Canada had the most advanced jet fighter in the world(avro arrow) ,Pretty much made our fighters look like something the wright brother were working on. they decided to destroy it , Why ? My guess is not to be a threat ,live in peace. But hey maybe the election will have an affect and we can send them up a few hundred 5 kiloton nukes to set up in the artic, Boy would I feel so much safer and don't forget the patriot missiles out of 9 jets shot down only 3 were us and uk. The more military might we have the safer I feel (thats a joke) Everyday I hear about illegals crossing into arizona ,Its way to easy for someone to get into this country and open a vial in phoenix in a crowd at the airport, what good are all the billions of dollars in nukes going to do us them . We are always a day late and not up to date. If Canada isn't blind it will stay at arms length with us.
Vermillion
QUOTE(carlitoswhey @ Jun 28 2004, 11:41 PM)


Firstly, it seem that the Liberals have won again, this time a minority government. What is very interesting is that the leftist party the NDP (New Democratic Party) holds the balance of power. Thus you can be sure Canada will go even further left after this election. Harper and his right-wing conservatives gained ground, but at the last minute people flocked away from his rightist message, as only two weeks ago he was confidently predicted to win.

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A big giant plank in Harper's platform was to strengthen the military, which in his words:
"Canadians are proud of our troops,” said Harper.  “But they’re embarrassed by the Liberals’ sinking subs, crashing choppers, green uniforms and their heavy reliance on the Americans for such basic tasks as long-range troop transport.” 


Canada's military had their budget slashed by Brian Mulroney, the last Conservative leader we had. The Liberals did little to increase the budget until the last few years, that is true. For this election, it was on everyone's platform to increase military spending, Harper a bit more than most.

But now some background: why was Canada's military allowed to languish?

14 years ago Canada faced a massive annual deficit, and the Liberal leadership decided to do something about it. They introduced a new tax and cut spending, which hurt, but as of the last decade, canada has been running at a surplus, sometimes a huge surplus, and a significant portion of that surplus has been going to pay down the national debt. Now that the economy is going strong again, money is going back into the military and other programs.

When was the last time the US made a significant effort to pay down the national debt? In real terms, as percentage of income, the Canadian debt has almost halved in 12 years.

Yes our military has languished, but it is rebuilding, and even its sorry state has not prevented us from taking a significant role in Afghanistan. Besides, Canada does not, and has never defined itself by its military.

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Surely you'll agree that there are plenty of Canadians that disagree with you and wouldn't mind becoming a bit more US-like in their gov't structure.  Like the ones that come here for health care, or to star in our movies and TV  biggrin.gif


Nobody will deny the basic truth: if you are filthy rich, there is no better place in the world to live than the US, period. Your television and movie industry is MUCH more developed than ours, so yes many of our stars go south, and I bet most Americans have no idea just how many starts are Canadian.

But in terms of medicine you are wrong. yes some of the wealthy do go to the elite US hospitals for specialised surgury at times, but far more Americans come to Canada, or buy your drugs here...
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