Full Version: Another Dropped Ball?
CJ:
You keep asking us to rely on the video. I did. The Video clearly shows that a "sealed bunker" (or we are led to believe its a sealed bunker) is being opened using a pair of bolt cutters. What the Video does NOT show is what is done with the chain that may have had the "seal" on it. If your looking for a reason that the "seal" may be missing then simply congratulate yourself, you provided some evidence.
As to solid proof one way or another there really is none for either side, that is unless you have the chemical tests back from what was pictured in the video, but then again, to provide such "rock solid" proof would require that a sample was obtained from the drums of white powder in the video. As of yet I have not seen this.
You keep asking us to rely on the video. I did. The Video clearly shows that a "sealed bunker" (or we are led to believe its a sealed bunker) is being opened using a pair of bolt cutters. What the Video does NOT show is what is done with the chain that may have had the "seal" on it. If your looking for a reason that the "seal" may be missing then simply congratulate yourself, you provided some evidence.
As to solid proof one way or another there really is none for either side, that is unless you have the chemical tests back from what was pictured in the video, but then again, to provide such "rock solid" proof would require that a sample was obtained from the drums of white powder in the video. As of yet I have not seen this.
Just to add fuel to the fire - Ambassador Peter W. Galbraith's testimony before the Senate Foreign Relations committee on July 12, 2003. He describes incidents of looting after the fall of baghdad that expose the flaws in our strategy of not protecting important buildings other than the oil minitsry 
Yep, the planning for Iraq was flawless alright. Now that this story has come out about the HMX and RDX it is seriously just the tip of the iceberg, I have a feeling that over the next months we are going to learn about all kinds of blunders. It all comes down to lack of planning and the responsibility lands on the lap of one man - and that man isn't John Kerry.
It cannot be made out in the video, but if you look at the follow up story there is a picture of a man pointing at the seal as well as some detailed photos of what a seal looks like in general. I posted it in a previous post, feel free to go back a few pages - it was one of the Minneapolis ABC reports.
QUOTE
When the United States entered Baghdad on April 9, it entered a city largely undamaged by a carefully executed military campaign. However, in the three weeks following the US takeover, unchecked looting effectively gutted every important public institution in the city—with the notable exception of the oil ministry.
<snip>
• On April 16, looters attacked the Iraqi equivalent of the Center for Disease Control taking live HIV and live black fever. The building had long been considered a highly suspicious place by both UNMOVIC and UNSCOM, and had been subject to repeated inspections. It is quite possible that the building contained evidence relating to Iraq’s biological weapons program, but if that is the case we may now never now. The Marine Lieutenant who from watched next door as looters ransacked the building told us: “I am afraid I am responsible for Armageddon, but no one told me what was in that building”. Fortunately, I saw no reason to believe that terrorists were involved in the theft of biological material, but this cannot be completely excluded.
• The warehouse at the Tuwaitha Nuclear site was left unguarded and looters took yellow cake and other material that could be useful for terrorists wanting to make a radiological weapon, and certainly could make the looters (and their families) sick.
<snip>
• On April 16, looters attacked the Iraqi equivalent of the Center for Disease Control taking live HIV and live black fever. The building had long been considered a highly suspicious place by both UNMOVIC and UNSCOM, and had been subject to repeated inspections. It is quite possible that the building contained evidence relating to Iraq’s biological weapons program, but if that is the case we may now never now. The Marine Lieutenant who from watched next door as looters ransacked the building told us: “I am afraid I am responsible for Armageddon, but no one told me what was in that building”. Fortunately, I saw no reason to believe that terrorists were involved in the theft of biological material, but this cannot be completely excluded.
• The warehouse at the Tuwaitha Nuclear site was left unguarded and looters took yellow cake and other material that could be useful for terrorists wanting to make a radiological weapon, and certainly could make the looters (and their families) sick.
Yep, the planning for Iraq was flawless alright. Now that this story has come out about the HMX and RDX it is seriously just the tip of the iceberg, I have a feeling that over the next months we are going to learn about all kinds of blunders. It all comes down to lack of planning and the responsibility lands on the lap of one man - and that man isn't John Kerry.
QUOTE(Redliner1989)
What the Video does NOT show is what is done with the chain that may have had the "seal" on it. If your looking for a reason that the "seal" may be missing then simply congratulate yourself, you provided some evidence.
It cannot be made out in the video, but if you look at the follow up story there is a picture of a man pointing at the seal as well as some detailed photos of what a seal looks like in general. I posted it in a previous post, feel free to go back a few pages - it was one of the Minneapolis ABC reports.
Is this an example of incompetence in prosecuting the Iraqi invasion - or is there a good reason for these explosives to have been left unguarded?
I'm only going to address this one question, as this subject has had its bones picked clean.
I'm sure the military mucka-mucks thought the city was secure, and they could afford the time while they guarded the oil wells and other infrastructure (besides, WMD was more important than mere, conventional explosives). As was reported widely at the time, troops were otherwise occupied guarding the Ministry of Oil and Ministry of Interior, hospitals and water plants, which were considered of primary importance. Meanwhile, looters ran wild, pillaging museums, stores and anything else that wasn't guarded. Why is it so hard to believe that some well-organized terrorists made off with explosives? How much they made off with is moot - the bunkers were left unguarded after being opened, and explosives disappeared. It sure as hell didn't evaporate. And there seems to be no shortage road bombs, truck bombs and suicide bombs.
The satellite photos on globalsecurity.org are excellent. It also proves the trucks were not parked at the bunkers containing the HMX.
I'm only going to address this one question, as this subject has had its bones picked clean.
I'm sure the military mucka-mucks thought the city was secure, and they could afford the time while they guarded the oil wells and other infrastructure (besides, WMD was more important than mere, conventional explosives). As was reported widely at the time, troops were otherwise occupied guarding the Ministry of Oil and Ministry of Interior, hospitals and water plants, which were considered of primary importance. Meanwhile, looters ran wild, pillaging museums, stores and anything else that wasn't guarded. Why is it so hard to believe that some well-organized terrorists made off with explosives? How much they made off with is moot - the bunkers were left unguarded after being opened, and explosives disappeared. It sure as hell didn't evaporate. And there seems to be no shortage road bombs, truck bombs and suicide bombs.
The satellite photos on globalsecurity.org are excellent. It also proves the trucks were not parked at the bunkers containing the HMX.
The stories are coming out of the woodwork I tell ya! Here is one about a different site from Salon.com (watching short ad req'd). I know it is from salon... but just read the story, it does start to establish a scary pattern if true.
So they find this huge dump of weapons and they have already been tipped off people are looting them...
The thing that is really disturbing about all of this is the pattern forming here now that all of these stories are coming to light. I still don't believe it speaks poorly of our military or their commanders, but rather the prioritzation and planning by high command and Bush himself.
The weapons that have been looted are now in the hands of insurgents and terrorists, they are killing and maiming our soldiers daily. I most definitely see just a little something wrong with that, almost criminal in fact.
QUOTE
Sometime in early May 2003, several local walk-ins came to the base and told me that there was a large weapons storage facility located about two or three kilometers to the south that was abandoned after the Iraqi forces fled the area following the collapse of the Saddam regime on April 9, 2003. The facility, they said, was still unguarded. The Iraqi guards had simply deserted their posts and disappeared. The storage facility, I was told, was an annex to the main base at Anaconda and was used by the Iraqi Air Force to store bombs, missiles and other ordnance. These same people said that they were concerned that their children might pick up some of the explosives or landmines that were stored there and blow themselves up. I was also told that local "Ali Babbas" or thieves were looting the site daily and word in the local communities was that they were selling the weapons and explosives to ex-Baath party members for use in attacking U.S forces.
My team and I immediately went out to the location, finding a huge facility perhaps 5 square miles or more in size. It was composed of dozens of both underground bunkers and above-ground storage buildings. I was stunned to see vast amounts of weapons simply lying around on the ground littering the base. Some of these weapons included surface-to-air and air-to-air missiles, land mines, rocket-propelled grenades, small arms ammunition, hand grenades, detonator caps, plastic explosives and other assorted ammunition and weaponry. It was quite a frightening sight.
My team and I immediately went out to the location, finding a huge facility perhaps 5 square miles or more in size. It was composed of dozens of both underground bunkers and above-ground storage buildings. I was stunned to see vast amounts of weapons simply lying around on the ground littering the base. Some of these weapons included surface-to-air and air-to-air missiles, land mines, rocket-propelled grenades, small arms ammunition, hand grenades, detonator caps, plastic explosives and other assorted ammunition and weaponry. It was quite a frightening sight.
So they find this huge dump of weapons and they have already been tipped off people are looting them...
QUOTE
My team took pictures of the site and all of the weapons and ammunition and filed a report immediately after returning to Anaconda. I also verbally briefed my battalion commander, Lt. Col. Timothy Ryan, as was the policy with any significant event such as this. Upon hearing my report, Lt. Col. Ryan requested that I take him back out to the site the next day, which I did. Ryan toured the facility just as I had done and saw all of the unsecured weaponry and ammunition. Ryan told me that he would talk to EOD (explosive ordinance disposal) and "have the stuff removed."
<snip>
For the next several weeks I continued to receive reports from my sources in the community that the weapons were still at the storage facility, there were still no guards, and the looting was continuing. I made three or four more trips to the site between May and August and confirmed that the facility was in fact unsecured and that weapons and ammunition were still exposed. On one such visit I actually saw some Iraqis in the distance driving a pickup truck and stopping at bunkers inside the storage facility, no doubt helping themselves. During one visit that summer, I took note of some land mines that were stored in an above-ground building at the site. The next time I visited the site, the land mines were gone.
<snip>
For the next several weeks I continued to receive reports from my sources in the community that the weapons were still at the storage facility, there were still no guards, and the looting was continuing. I made three or four more trips to the site between May and August and confirmed that the facility was in fact unsecured and that weapons and ammunition were still exposed. On one such visit I actually saw some Iraqis in the distance driving a pickup truck and stopping at bunkers inside the storage facility, no doubt helping themselves. During one visit that summer, I took note of some land mines that were stored in an above-ground building at the site. The next time I visited the site, the land mines were gone.
The thing that is really disturbing about all of this is the pattern forming here now that all of these stories are coming to light. I still don't believe it speaks poorly of our military or their commanders, but rather the prioritzation and planning by high command and Bush himself.
The weapons that have been looted are now in the hands of insurgents and terrorists, they are killing and maiming our soldiers daily. I most definitely see just a little something wrong with that, almost criminal in fact.
I watched the video and didnt see any seals cut. I saw a chain cut but no seal. I saw a seal on a door, then a guy climbing into the ventilator shaft on the building with the seal, then they did not enter the building. Could it be he did not see anything in the building? Perhaps, but let's get back to the timeline.
Maj. Austin Pearson was ordered to destroy ammunition and explosives. His team arrived at Al-Qaqaa on April 13th, 2003 and took out 250 tons of munitions and other material from the site.
The video from KSTP says they are not certian that it was taken in Al Qaaqaa. The video was taken on April 18th. At this time the 101st also had a perimiter around the site.
So the video, that they are not sure if it was taken at the site, was after Austin Pearson and his team arrived at Al Qaaqaa. So one thing is clear, the explosive's that were in the video tape were not destroyed by Austin Pearson's men at the site. But it cannot be said conclusively that this footage was even taken at the site.
So what is clear is that the order was given to destroy the ammo and munitions at this site, and the video was taken after this order was given and after they showed up at the site and took the explosives out.
So if you want to use this video, it can no longer be used as case against GWB (and wasnt in the first place).
Even if these explosives were in Al Qaaqaa, it had been ordered to destroy them days before the video and the 3rd ID failed to identify and destroy them, and even if it had been looted, they escaped the 101st Airborne's perimeter.
So if you want to make a case with this video about these explosives escaping our troops, even when they have destroyed over 400,000 tons of explosives and munitions, then by all means proceed with the court martial.
It is not even known if these were looted and in fact could have been destroyed after the tape was taken.
Maj. Austin Pearson was ordered to destroy ammunition and explosives. His team arrived at Al-Qaqaa on April 13th, 2003 and took out 250 tons of munitions and other material from the site.
The video from KSTP says they are not certian that it was taken in Al Qaaqaa. The video was taken on April 18th. At this time the 101st also had a perimiter around the site.
So the video, that they are not sure if it was taken at the site, was after Austin Pearson and his team arrived at Al Qaaqaa. So one thing is clear, the explosive's that were in the video tape were not destroyed by Austin Pearson's men at the site. But it cannot be said conclusively that this footage was even taken at the site.
So what is clear is that the order was given to destroy the ammo and munitions at this site, and the video was taken after this order was given and after they showed up at the site and took the explosives out.
So if you want to use this video, it can no longer be used as case against GWB (and wasnt in the first place).
Even if these explosives were in Al Qaaqaa, it had been ordered to destroy them days before the video and the 3rd ID failed to identify and destroy them, and even if it had been looted, they escaped the 101st Airborne's perimeter.
So if you want to make a case with this video about these explosives escaping our troops, even when they have destroyed over 400,000 tons of explosives and munitions, then by all means proceed with the court martial.
It is not even known if these were looted and in fact could have been destroyed after the tape was taken.
USAToday Story
Though this does not definitely prove that the explosives in question were not looted it does raise some questions about that story as the US Military took 250 tons of explosives from the site and destroyed them.
If they were not at least part of the 380 tons of explosives in question then why were the original numbers of what was stored at that site actually 630 tons or more?
There are still unanswered questions here, but this information is certainly worth consideration.
Though this does not definitely prove that the explosives in question were not looted it does raise some questions about that story as the US Military took 250 tons of explosives from the site and destroyed them.
If they were not at least part of the 380 tons of explosives in question then why were the original numbers of what was stored at that site actually 630 tons or more?
There are still unanswered questions here, but this information is certainly worth consideration.
No one knows how much explosives were at the site. It's all speculation, the UN inspectors also noted that explosives were being taken from the site.
It's been reported that there were only 3 tons of RDX and HMX at the site.
http://www.abcnews.go.com/WNT/story?id=204304&page=1
The IAEA is hiding something here. There's definitely some deception going on by some UN staff members.
It's been reported that there were only 3 tons of RDX and HMX at the site.
http://www.abcnews.go.com/WNT/story?id=204304&page=1
QUOTE
But the confidential IAEA documents obtained by ABC News show that on Jan. 14, 2003, the agency's inspectors recorded that just over three tons of RDX were stored at the facility — a considerable discrepancy from what the Iraqis reported.
The IAEA is hiding something here. There's definitely some deception going on by some UN staff members.
Vampiel
I don't know how you can make the distinction. How many times have have we not seen how no one in this matter has much of an idea what was there and what went missing?
How can you just ignore every article that runs counter to your belief? Do you have a set opinion that cannot tolerate any evidence that might prove it wrong?
From where I'm sitting, this whole case is one giant mess. No one knows anything and all sides are making claim upon claim and its gotten to the point where no one can say what took place at al Qaqaa.
From overlandsailor's article
Does any one actually believe this? How can any one believe that Dick Cheney has the facts?
Do you believe the Pentagon knows what its talking about considering the confusion that reigns supreme in this matter?
According to this article, a French journalist actually saw weapons being looted by Iraqi insurgents at al Qaqaa...
Finally, this from overlandsailor's article
How can any of this be the fault of John Kerry?
QUOTE
The IAEA is hiding something here. There's definitely some deception going on by some UN staff members.
I don't know how you can make the distinction. How many times have have we not seen how no one in this matter has much of an idea what was there and what went missing?
How can you just ignore every article that runs counter to your belief? Do you have a set opinion that cannot tolerate any evidence that might prove it wrong?
From where I'm sitting, this whole case is one giant mess. No one knows anything and all sides are making claim upon claim and its gotten to the point where no one can say what took place at al Qaqaa.
From overlandsailor's article
QUOTE
Cheney said the Pentagon announcement "shows clearly that Sen. Kerry didn't know what he was talking about and neither did the New York Times."
Does any one actually believe this? How can any one believe that Dick Cheney has the facts?
Do you believe the Pentagon knows what its talking about considering the confusion that reigns supreme in this matter?
According to this article, a French journalist actually saw weapons being looted by Iraqi insurgents at al Qaqaa...
QUOTE
A French journalist who visited the Qaqaa munitions depot south of Baghdad in November last year said she witnessed Islamic insurgents looting vast supplies of explosives more than six months after the demise of Saddam Hussein's regime.
Is this woman a liar or is Dick Cheney willing to say anything to divert attention? QUOTE
"I was utterly stupefied to see that a place like that was pretty much unguarded and that insurgents could help themselves for months on end," Daniel said on Friday. "We were there for a long time and no one disturbed the group while they were loading their truck."
Finally, this from overlandsailor's article
QUOTE
But at least another 250,000 tons from Saddam's regime remain unaccounted for, and some has undoubtedly fallen into the hands of insurgents.
How can any of this be the fault of John Kerry?
QUOTE(DaytonRocker @ Oct 29 2004, 12:22 PM)
I think the wheels have completely fallen off of this issue. From what I'm reading, the Pentagon put someone up in a press conference to vouch for the removal of 200 tons of the stuff.
Apparently, the press ate him alive. The tape is devastating and there is no way around it.
The problem for Bush - other than the continued lying - is he needs to explain how the stuff was safe from terrorists before we invaded (it was sealed) and now it's not. That's the bottom line.
Apparently, the press ate him alive. The tape is devastating and there is no way around it.
The problem for Bush - other than the continued lying - is he needs to explain how the stuff was safe from terrorists before we invaded (it was sealed) and now it's not. That's the bottom line.
Geez, I wonder if we saw the same press conference because the press most definately did NOT eat him alive. Of course, given the anti-Bush zealotry you've displayed, no surprise you've come to this conclusion.
Major Austin Pearson of the 24th Ordinance Company, 24th Corps Support Group was the man who was in charge of the force charged with the removal of high explosives, blasting caps, and so on from the Al-Qaqaa facility.
Here's the transcript from the Washington Post (it's rather lengthy):
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/artic...t29.html?sub=AR
I always love how the left claims to support the troops and so on, but at the first chance they get, they call them incompetent (CJ and his ilk's words) without allowing the facts to be revealed.
Edit:
QUOTE
He thinks his unit removed a couple hundred, 250 tons of ammunition. It encompasses a variety of ammunition. It encompasses -- he has photos that were not -- we may provide later; we’re reviewing those photos -- that reflect the types of -- in some cases the types of ammunition that have been seen on other video that’s been made available to the public within the last day or two: large boxes of plastic explosives, those sorts of things, I think commonly referred to by some as RDX by the ordnance handlers themselves.
Apparently the Major provided photos of what is believed to be RDX that was being loaded onto the trucks for destruction. So apparently the Army was doing it's job, unlike the assertions of the ABB crowd.
QUOTE(GBA @ Oct 31 2004, 12:35 AM)
Geez, I wonder if we saw the same press conference because the press most definately did NOT eat him alive. Of course, given the anti-Bush zealotry you've displayed, no surprise you've come to this conclusion.
Let's stay away from the personal commentary and stick to the issues.
TOPICS:
Is this an example of incompetence in prosecuting the Iraqi invasion - or is there a good reason for these explosives to have been left unguarded?
Is the fact that this theft has not been previously reported part of a "political" cover-up - or a matter of national security?
Do you believe that all 350 tons of explosives are still within Iraq - or have they been exported elsewhere? If so, where?
QUOTE
I don't know how you can make the distinction. How many times have have we not seen how no one in this matter has much of an idea what was there and what went missing?
I agree with that although it is telling that the IAEA did not cite the report that only 3 tons of it was confirmed to be there and not the 380 tons declared. After all it was Saddam that declared how much WMD he had and we still dont know if they even existed.
QUOTE
From where I'm sitting, this whole case is one giant mess. No one knows anything and all sides are making claim upon claim and its gotten to the point where no one can say what took place at al Qaqaa.
Agreed.
QUOTE
Does any one actually believe this? How can any one believe that Dick Cheney has the facts?
Do you believe the Pentagon knows what its talking about considering the confusion that reigns supreme in this matter?
Do you believe the Pentagon knows what its talking about considering the confusion that reigns supreme in this matter?
I agree with what Cheney said how can you not? Kerry did no have the facts and yet he ran with a misleading report by the Times who did not have all the facts.
QUOTE
Is this woman a liar or is Dick Cheney willing to say anything to divert attention?
If this journalist saw this is there a report from the army? Did she just observe this action without reporting it to the US military? They where swarming in the area.
QUOTE
But at least another 250,000 tons from Saddam's regime remain unaccounted for, and some has undoubtedly fallen into the hands of insurgents.
Again this is the declared estimate. No one knows how much was really there before and just after the conventional war (just as in the case of WMD's).
QUOTE
How can any of this be the fault of John Kerry?
It's is Kerry's fault for using outlandish attack's with selective speculative fact's that were not confirmed in any way. Basically he ran with a very weak story that did not have much to back it up before more investigating was done.
Do I blame him? No every politician does.
Amongst other things, I read today this article
And I wonder. Now that the election is over with. Does this article make any difference?
Does it matter that the mismanagement of 'post war' Iraq has allowed the arming of a substantial Iraqi rebellion?
And, will GW Bush now be forced to deal with the mess he has made, with no one but himself to blame when these explosives are used against US and coalition troops?
QUOTE
U.S. Army reservists and National Guardsmen witnessed the looting and some soldiers sent messages to commanders in Baghdad requesting help, but received no reply, they said.
"It was complete chaos. It was looting like L.A. during the Rodney King riots," one officer said.
"It was complete chaos. It was looting like L.A. during the Rodney King riots," one officer said.
QUOTE
Soldiers who belong to two different units described how Iraqis snatched explosives from unsecured bunkers and drove off with them in pickup trucks.
The soldiers who spoke to the Times asked to remain unidentified, saying they feared retaliation from the Pentagon.
The soldiers said they could not confirm that looters took the particularly powerful explosives known as HMX and RDX. One soldier, however, said U.S. forces saw looters load trucks with bags marked "hexamine," which is a key ingredient for HMX.
One senior noncommissioned officer said troops "were running from one side of the compound to the other side, trying to kick people out" and that at least 100 vehicles were at the site waiting for the military to leave so that they could loot the munitions.
The soldiers who spoke to the Times asked to remain unidentified, saying they feared retaliation from the Pentagon.
The soldiers said they could not confirm that looters took the particularly powerful explosives known as HMX and RDX. One soldier, however, said U.S. forces saw looters load trucks with bags marked "hexamine," which is a key ingredient for HMX.
One senior noncommissioned officer said troops "were running from one side of the compound to the other side, trying to kick people out" and that at least 100 vehicles were at the site waiting for the military to leave so that they could loot the munitions.
And I wonder. Now that the election is over with. Does this article make any difference?
Does it matter that the mismanagement of 'post war' Iraq has allowed the arming of a substantial Iraqi rebellion?
And, will GW Bush now be forced to deal with the mess he has made, with no one but himself to blame when these explosives are used against US and coalition troops?
12 unidentified soldier's stationed around the facility that called in with no reply. Sounds a little suspicious but the pentagon should have no trouble pulling up from the records who they are right? They should also have records of any transmissions sent.
This story should be investigated and if they are lying they should be repremanded. If not it should be found out why there was not responce.
I have a hard time believing that there was no responce... at all. Especially since soldiers where swarming in the general area.
This story should be investigated and if they are lying they should be repremanded. If not it should be found out why there was not responce.
I have a hard time believing that there was no responce... at all. Especially since soldiers where swarming in the general area.
Well, this is one of the benefits of Bush winning the election.
I really don't care about this issue anymore. In fact, as much as I hope not as much as a hair on any innocent Iraqi or any American in Iraq gets hurt, I really don't care any more.
The people knew about this story before the election - along with the many many other issues along these lines - and voted for Bush to "stay the course". And this is the course that's been set. No mistakes. No accountability. No nothing.
We deserve all the consequences we get because of this. The soldiers deserve it. The Iraqis deserve it. I'm not going to get bummed over needless deaths anymore because I don't have to. I did my part to improve the situation by voting Bush out. 51,000,000 others think I'm full of crap. And they win.
It just isn't my problem anymore. I've been relieved by insanity.
I really don't care about this issue anymore. In fact, as much as I hope not as much as a hair on any innocent Iraqi or any American in Iraq gets hurt, I really don't care any more.
The people knew about this story before the election - along with the many many other issues along these lines - and voted for Bush to "stay the course". And this is the course that's been set. No mistakes. No accountability. No nothing.
We deserve all the consequences we get because of this. The soldiers deserve it. The Iraqis deserve it. I'm not going to get bummed over needless deaths anymore because I don't have to. I did my part to improve the situation by voting Bush out. 51,000,000 others think I'm full of crap. And they win.
It just isn't my problem anymore. I've been relieved by insanity.
It gets better.
Now, Human Rights Watch is saying that due to the negligence and lack of security after the fall of Baghdad, a lot of evidence against Saddam Hussein has 'gone missing'.
http://www.hrw.org/campaigns/iraq/graves/
Dayton Rocker.
I feel for you, though those words might be but a bitter irony given our political differences.
However I would also remind you that being absolved of responsibility should not induce you to turn your back on the deaths of innocent people.
You still have an obligation to yourself to stand for what you believe in.
51 million may disagree with you with regards to GW Bush and his competance, but 48 million Americans agreed with you as well.
Now, Human Rights Watch is saying that due to the negligence and lack of security after the fall of Baghdad, a lot of evidence against Saddam Hussein has 'gone missing'.
http://www.hrw.org/campaigns/iraq/graves/
Dayton Rocker.
I feel for you, though those words might be but a bitter irony given our political differences.
However I would also remind you that being absolved of responsibility should not induce you to turn your back on the deaths of innocent people.
You still have an obligation to yourself to stand for what you believe in.
51 million may disagree with you with regards to GW Bush and his competance, but 48 million Americans agreed with you as well.
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