Who invented the run-on sentence, Wehrwolf? Try mixing in a period, dude.

Has Black History Month served its purpose, dragged on long past its "sell-by" date or still has a prominent role to play in bringing about racial equality and diversity?

Well, any one can make a borderline racist statement like "...a racial group so lacking in accomplishments as sub-Saharan Africans has an entire month devoted to their "history...." is just begging not to be taken seriously and I have no problem in complying.

Apparently as long as such attitudes as yours Wehrwolf exist there will always be a need for Black History Month. Your statement that people of African descent have contributed little or nothing of note is indicative of a belief system that sees the world through glasses of White supremacy and Black inferiority.

I ask that you treat me with the level of respect that I treat you with. As far as I know, snide, uncivil remarks are forbidden here.



Flat-Earthers and Creationists are upset by scientific proof that the world is a spehroid and that all life on Earth has a common origin circa 4 BYBP, respectively. Radical Egalitarians exhibit similar sentiments (and the corresponding behavior) when confronted with hard evidence supporting the fact that the races differ in significant physical, cognitive, and behavioral respects.

nighttimer, would you care to actually challenge my statement, rather than resort to the very tired old "racist" ad hominen attack, which serves time and time again to wholly dodge a debate sure to be a scathing defeat for the tower of the PC party line?

Has Black History Month served its purpose, dragged on long past its "sell-by" date or still has a prominent role to play in bringing about racial equality and diversity?

I think black history month is definitely still relevant if for no other reason than to remind ourselves of the genocide our country is built on. There has always been a tendency to claim slavery was somehow fun and the plantation system was glamorous. If Black History month can only teach America how pervasive and insidious slavery was, it has done enough. As Americans we can never forget the majority of our history where we treated people with such incredible inhumanity. The lessons we get from slavery also need to be applied to our current stance in the world, especially in countries like the Sudan with their own genocides going on. People don't know enough history anyway to begin with and black history is a massive part of our history.

Now as to the guilt trip part, I don't see it that way. As Americans we have a shared history that has many proud moments, but also genocide, unfairness and greed. But from those evils Americans shouldn't feel guilt, we should feel resolve to never forget and never allow it to happen again.

Snideness and incivility are no-nos. Sarcasm and humor are not. If you grasp the difference, you'll probably understand how posting on this board works.



So where exactly is this "hard evidence supporting the fact that the races differ in significant physical, cognitive, and behaviorial respects?" And what conclusion do you draw from the fact that (duh) people are different?

As for being a "Radical Egalitarian," I thank you for the backhanded compliment.



No, I would not care to challenge your wholly fallacious statement, Wehrwolf because to debate a ridiculous absurdity over the historical contributions of Black people to society is to dignify it. Like most racially-obsessed elitists you've got your talking points down, but your facts are sadly in a state of total disarray.

I do not have to "dodge a debate" over the inventions and innovations of a Dr. Daniel Hale Williams, Eubie Blake, Zora Neale Hurston, Elijah McCoy, Dr. Charles Drew, Robert Johnson, Duke Ellington, Adam Clayton Powell, A. Phillip Randolph, Marian Anderson, Dr. Benjamin Carson, James Weldon Johnson, Elijah Pierce, James Van Der Zee, Richard Wright, Ralph Ellison, Ella Fitzgerald, Charlie Parker, Thelonious Monk, Claude McKay, Marvin Gaye, Paul Robeson, Langston Hughes, Madame C.J. Walker, Nikki Giovanni or Miles Davis with someone so apparently unfamiliar with the width, breath and brilliance of Black thought, Black creativity and Black genius.

Engaging in such a desultory, superficial and superfluous debate over well-established facts already in evidence would only be a trivial waste of my time and bore everyone else. You can not bait me into such a ridiculous and tautological argument.

For an apparently intelligent and educated individual such as yourself Wehrwolf to engage in such sophistry as to try to diminish the contributions of Blacks to the larger culture is the sad triumph of polarized race politics over the evidence of historical precedent.

I'm curious to your mindset here, "nighttimer". While I cannot deny the outstanding characteristics of the individuals you noted (including some of my all time favorites), I don't understand what "Black thought", "Black creativity" and "Black genius" refers to. Perhaps you could enlighten me?

What I'm most interested in is how those definitions differ from the terms "thinker", "highly creative individual" and "genius".

When talking about black achievement in music one runs the risk of falling back on a “Mr. Bojangles” stereotype. I am going to address this issue from a musical standpoint simply because I know more about that than some other areas.

Mr. Bojangles Lyrics

Wehrwolf I don’t know how you define “music” but to you and other folks, blacks have had an enormous role in the development of American, European and world music, especially during the past 50 years. In fact, one could almost teach a semester course on Black contributions to music alone.

I am one of those eclectic, cross-culturalized or if someone wants to call me that a “spiritually mongrelized” individual. I haven’t indulged in alcohol or tobacco, but I’ve drifted in and out of nightclubs (where alcoholic stupors and a haze of smoke abound), auditoriums and other venues where jazz, blues, rhythm and blues, rock ‘n’ roll and country are played. I have an extensive collection of CDs that crosses genres.

Where Do I start? Rock ‘n’ Roll?

It’s really hard to say when rock ‘n’ roll actually started. Some would argue that Bill Haley’s “Rock Around the Clock” from the 1954 movie Blackboard Jungle was first. Fats Domino would argue that the genre had been played in New Orleans for fifty years, but that they called it something else.

I personally date rock from 1955. This was the year that Chuck Berry, Little Richard, Elvis Presley and others (both black and white) began to define rock.

Of all the pioneers, Berry was, in my opinion, the most important and my favorite. At age 78 he still plays monthly at a club called Blueberry Hill in his native St. Louis. Within the last two months he has played in France, Germany and for the first time in Czechoslovakia.

Berry was important for a couple of reasons, When “Maybellene” hit Billboard’s charts in 1955 Berry was almost 30-years-old, but gifted with the ability to write songs that appealed to white teenagers.

“School Day” a number some have called the first popular protest song was released in 1957.



School Day Lyrics

Those words became the battle cry for a new generation of teenagers delivered from the inane and anemic clatter of Patti Page’s “Doggie in the Window” or the TV show Your Hit Parade, featuring the likes of Russell Arms, Gisele MacKenzie, Snooky Lanson and other early media creations, who didn't quite have the talent or imagination to make hit records on their own. Your Hit Parade died when the non-talents couldn't sing Little Richard's songs fast enough or with the raw energy and conviction in Richard's recordings.


Your Hit Parade

In 1962, Berry went to federal prison, but as someone put it “he managed, like a cat, to land on his feet.” Shortly after his release, the British invasion started. The Beatles released “Roll Over Beethoven,” The Rolling Stones did “Carol.” I could go on. Practically every British band to come down the pike did a song written or performed by Berry, Little Richard, Larry Williams or Wilbur Harrison.

Then we have Pat Boone, who ripped off Little Richard’s “Tutti Frutti” and “Long Tall Sally,” after hearing them on a black Fort Worth radio station (KNOK) and releasing his own sanitized versions. As Richard once put it, "Pat Boone didn't even know how to duck back in no alley."

How About Blues?

Until B. B. King’s enormous 1969 hit “The Thrill is Gone,” black American blues singers had actually done better in Europe than the U. S. As we focused on the blues, white Americans like Stevie Ray Vaughan began performing the genre.

Jazz—Is it America’s Only Unique Contribution to the Arts?

Like rock ‘n’ roll and blues, American jazz performers have done well in Europe. Jazz has a long history of integration. Benny Goodman was one of, if not the, first prominent white band leader to employ black—pianist Teddy Wilson and the legendary vibe player Lionel Hampton. I once saw Count Basie when he played Fort Worth and he had a white drummer named Duffy Jackson. Goodman is called the “King of Swing,” but the could just have easily fit Count Basie or Duke Ellington. The quality of other black bands like Jimmy Lunceford and Lucky Millinder was at least as good as either of the Dorsey Brothers or Woody Herman.

Equally important are the contributions of Charlie Parker, Miles Davis and John Coltrane and vocalists like Billie Holliday, Ella Fitzgerald, Sarah Vaughan and Diana Washington.

I could go on, but I’ve put a lot of effort into this post and I’m tired of typing. If anyone wants to fill in the blanks, I would strongly recommend Ken Burns Jazz. It’s available on 10 VHS cassettes at the Fort Worth Public Library and probably other libraries across the country. It first aired on PBS some years ago.

Ken Burns Jazz

In Summation

Wehrwolf you’ve got it dead backwards. American musicians, particularly black American musicians, have given to Europe—not the other way around and in doing so they have helped--in my opinion, been the driving force--in creating something uniquely American.

There is no difference. It is purely my subjective definition in response to a poster who feels there is no "Black thought," "Black creativity" or "Black genius."

To further clarify this, my suggestion is to play Kind of Blue repeatedly until the thinking, highly creative individuals that put this masterpiece of musical genius together becomes clear, "lordhelmet."

http://www.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&t...10:dm5zefbk7gf2

If there is no difference, then it doesn't need to be said, does it?

With respect to inspiration, I'll stick to Jo Jones, Elvin Jones, Tony Williams (rip), Billy Cobham, and Dennis Chambers, thank you.

Has Black History Month served its purpose, dragged on long past its "sell-by" date or still has a prominent role to play in bringing about racial equality and diversity?

I don't know really. Don't such things exist because at some level there is still a need for them?

Perhaps the emphasis on Africans as opposed to all other minoritites is unjust given the history of the world as we perceive it, but essentially, doesn't the reminder of the past serve to educate us in what once went wrong so that we don't repeat our mistakes?

I personally (as a Scandinavian) feel no particular guilt or remorse towards African/ black people for what once happened to them, but I do recognise that they still carry the burden of the past and if that means I, as a Scandinavian/ white person, have to 'endure' a few reminders about what the abuse of power can lead to, then its a small price to pay if the understanding that they do matter enough to warrant some form of celebration which is denied to to the rest of us can help black/African people come to terms with their past.

Living my life of extreme fortune and comfort, I can't begrudge any one less fortunate than me the small privelidge that they receive some attention as to the value of their 'people'.

To do so is but churlish and any one of European/white background who complains about' unfair treatment' is just being mean.

No, I didn't think so, but then I thought it was fairily obvious anyway.
BoF certainly seemed to pick up on this without any difficulty.



With the exception of Dennis Chambers,all the drummers you mention worked with Miles Davis, so you've chosen well whom you draw your musical inspiration from.

As did they.

but for some reason, I could never stand Max Roach.... I wish Buddy would have sat in with Miles. Miles wasn't "big band" but he could play absolutely anything.