http://mediamatters.org/items/200505180008

QUESTIONS:
1) First of all, Does this constitute a thread to the life of another individual?

2) Is this any different than the comic pre-recorded parody sketch of a fictional organization that was run on a liberal radio show?

3) Does this statement merit similar, more , or less reaction to the one made on liberal radio?

4) Considering that this story has grown no legs in the "mainstream" media, particularly in comparison to that of the liberal radio story, does it show a right wing bias in the "mainstream" media?

5) Where is the outrage from the right about personal responsibility?

6) Why are there no calls for the termination of this "personality", or penalties for the media company he is employed by - such as the outcry against Newsweek magazine these past few days?

7) What would you consider appropriate reconciliation?

8) Does it make a difference if one threat is against the president, and the other is against a "celebrity"?

The law is clear that it is illegal to threaten the President.

The law is much more sketchy when it comes to threatening some other individual.

For example, my boss might say "I'm gonna kill" an employee who is late to an important meeting. This is not a crime if the employee is not in fear of bodily harm. If the employee is in fear of bodily harm, then the statement does become a crime.

If Michael Moore was in fear of his life from Glenn Beck, then this becomes a potential crime. Otherwise, it's just poor comedy.

Does Michael Moore have sole discretion to decide if he should be in fear of his life or not?

I'm curious, Charged Dust - do you ever actually listen to Glenn Beck or did you just receive notice of this "threat" through the link you provided? The reason I ask is because I am a pretty regular listener of his show and know that it is primarily politically-based schtick. I am comfortable saying with 100% certainty that Glenn Beck was not serious and will never take any steps to pursue Moore in a physically threatening way.

Your questions appear to be a means to try and shake something up where there is nothing. Why is there no outrage? Because none is necessary. This was silliness. Just like Randi Rhodes and her bit about the gunshots. Obviously, humor is subjective, but we really need to recognize both of these instances as humor and nothing more. Why create drama where there is none?

I will agree with what I perceive is your underlying premise - that many in the mainstream media, on both sides, often use heated, inflammatory rhetoric without giving much thought to the depth or consequences of those words. In fact, I complained about this such thing in my blog yesterday.

However, I think someone who is known to be a satirist making such a "threat" is merely exercising their free speech rights - no matter if the threat is against the president or any public figure. Moore has nothing to fear from Glenn Beck.

I've never heard of Glenn Beck, so as a right leaner who doesn't listen to talk radio (with the exception of NPR) I didn't know I was suppose say anything about personal responsibility. However, I find "jokes" like this one appalling.

When Air America put out a parody about killing GW, I was outraged and as Amlord said that is against the law.

I am equally outraged by the excerpt you provided, ChargedDust. This nastiness being played out between the left and the right has become too personal. Just yesterday another Hitler comparison was made by Rick Santorum.

Many Americans have lost their decency (especially those who represent us whether through politics or entertainment) and we've lost a lot of respect throughout the world because of it.

Glenn Beck is probably the least "right" of the conservative talk show hosts. As Jamie has stated much of his stuff is not intended seriously. I personally don't care much for jokes about killing an individual, but this is hardly worthy of any media attention. To be honest, outside of this board, I did not see much media attention over the Bush joke.

6) Why are there no calls for the termination of this "personality", or penalties for the media company he is employed by - such as the outcry against Newsweek magazine these past few days?

Are you serious? Comparing a somewhat distasteful satiric joke with publishing unverified information which led to riots and deaths and tainted our image abroad?

No


No, just happened to stuble on it.



Actually I agree, I want to eplore the thoughts of others, those who were outraged at the SKIT by Randi Rhodes, to see if they are likewise outraged by the comments that are certainly less SKIT-like by Glenn Beck



Again, personal responsability. The riots are the responsability of the rioters, the deaths are the responsability of the murderers, our image was tainted by the people who dessecrated the holy book of the prisoners not by newsweek reporting it. And lastly newsweek isn't saying that the account is erroneous, just that the source is NOW backing away from it to some degree. I will add that the pentagon was provided a copy of this article before it was printed and offered no objections to it. This is all the subject matter of another topic, but I took the time to reply to it specifically because it touches on my question about personal responsability. SO yes, I am serious.

Take a look at a sample of the interest sparked by the skit on Randi Rhodes' show...


http://www.invincibleironman.com/hube/mt/a...ves/000697.html
http://www.libertypost.org/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=93521
http://www.lipserv.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3665
http://mightyrighty.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-1383.html
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread136862/pg1
http://rhymeswithright.mu.nu/archives/078404.php
http://www.vendio.com/mesg/read.html?num=28&thread=252083
http://www.rightnation.us/forums/index.php?showtopic=75636
http://www.pardonmyenglish.com/archives/20...merica_und.html
http://www.nationalledger.com/scribe/archi...erica_hos.shtml
http://michellemalkin.com/mt/mt-tb.cgi?__m...w&entry_id=2241
http://www.balloon-juice.com/archives/004996.html
http://billboardradiomonitor.com/radiomoni...t_id=1000900765
http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadA...le.asp?ID=17878
http://www.themoderatevoice.com/posts/1114652573.shtml
http://www.liberallunacy.net/dossiers/RandiRhodes.htm
http://theedge.bostonherald.com/tvNews/vie...articleid=80566
http://www.bigpicweblog.com/exp/index.php/..._rhodes_busted/
http://www.democrats.com/node/4409
http://www.nypost.com/entertainment/23522.htm
http://www.drudgereport.com/mattabt.htm
http://s88251339.onlinehome.us/smartercop/...ves/003183.html
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2004/5/12/153908.shtml
http://webpages.charter.net/maxflack/RANDI%20RHODES.htm
http://209.157.64.200/focus/f-news/1393242/posts
http://www.voy.com/193697/127.html
http://www.museumofleftwinglunacy.com/arch..._rhodes_si.html
http://worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=44014

Granted, many are blogs, boards or private sites, the most "mainstream" source that came up in the google sraech was the NY Post, but I do remember seeing it reported in all three major NYC dailys at the time. Many of these source either Drudge or Newsmax, but that so many leaped upon it to be able to print it in thier own pages says something - IMO. Also, it earned much airtime on cable news channels at the time. WAY too much for a "skit".

Quite possibly my favorite quote is this one, and which partially inspired my questions...



Where are the calls for criminal enforcement like these:


http://209.157.64.200/focus/f-news/1393242/posts


http://www.themoderatevoice.com/posts/1114652573.shtml


So I cannot help but wonder why there is no such similar outcry at the contemplation of murder (under LESS obviously comic circumstances) from the "CULTURE OF LIFE" side of the aisle.

1) First of all, Does this constitute a thread to the life of another individual?
I do not believe that it does. Moronic yes, threating, doesn't make it.

2) Is this any different than the comic pre-recorded parody sketch of a fictional organization that was run on a liberal radio show? I believe that this sounds closer to being a threat than the one run before about the President

3) Does this statement merit similar, more , or less reaction to the one made on liberal radio? I believe that it should have the same reaction. I think both were tastless, stupid and without any social value or merit.

4) Considering that this story has grown no legs in the "mainstream" media, particularly in comparison to that of the liberal radio story, does it show a right wing bias in the "mainstream" media? I feel that the person that it was directed at has more to do with it. If it was about former President Clinton the reaction might have been there.

5) Where is the outrage from the right about personal responsibility? I can't answer for the right, but I think Mr. Beck is an idiot.

6) Why are there no calls for the termination of this "personality", or penalties for the media company he is employed by - such as the outcry against Newsweek magazine these past few days? I do not believe that either radio personality rises to such a level.

7) What would you consider appropriate reconciliation?I am going to continue to ignore both idiots.

8) Does it make a difference if one threat is against the president, and the other is against a "celebrity"?The law says there is, but I for one do not feel that a "celebrity" is an less of a person than the President.

It seems like of all the sources CD posted the most mainstream is the entertainment section of the New York Post. The story was a non-event except for extreme partisans of the right and left. We, at this forum, tend to spend much more time on political issues than the typical American. I think the typical American is probably pretty smart to ignore the partisan squabbles of bloggers and talk radio personalities.

We protect the President for the same reason we protect policeman, to protect law and order. Something that is a must for any society.

Let us compare the potential worst case scenarios of both skits and of the Newsweek gross violations of journalistic standards. Beck's skit: Moore gets killed by someone inspired by the skit. Rhodes skit: Bush is assassinated by someone inspired by the skit. I've lived through a Presidential assassination. I don't want see our country go through another. I would not wish to see Mr. Moore killed either. Both skits were stupid. I just give a higher degree of stupidity to Rhodes skit.

Newsweek, unlike Rhodes and Beck, is suppossed to be a reliable source of news. Their failure to follow standards, any Journalism 101 student would know, has already led to deaths and could inspire the next successful major terrorist attack on our soil.

The good thing about living in America is: Our leaders and law enforcers are no more deserving of protection from criminal activity than the least of us (under written law, that is). While killing a cop might get you more prison time than killing a tax accountant, outside the pervue of the officer's duties, there is nothing you can legally do to a citizen that you can't do to a police officer. So refusing to let some guy off the street handcuff you to a lightpost is legal, but resisting arrest is illegal. It's legal to run from your granny when she drives behind you, honking for you to slow down, but not to run from blue lights, and so on. In fact, police officers are expected to endure more verbal abuse than a regular citizen is, so long as that verbal abuse does not involve serious threat. The bad thing about making special laws so that it is illegal to joke about killing a President while allowing jokes about killing celebrities is that people might get the impression a President's life and safety is worth more than an entertainer's. And our "created equal" foundation, while never seriously meant to include the "unwashed masses" and while never fully implemented, is still a concept that survives in our soil. I wouldn't want to see it squashed with the enforcement of laws like this, that set officials above the common sort.

I agree. Unlike Sean Hannity (for instance), Glenn Beck's entire show is basically satire as any listener knows. He has not contemplated murder. Someone has picked up on one line out of thousands (out of context) and is riding with it. Glenn Beck is hardly a conservative or Republican thinktank, and of all the talk radio taking heads I've come across (on both sides) is probably one of the most open-minded and level-headed.